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Posted: **Sat Jan 19, 2008 11:25 pm**

Luke M wrote:I think if you actually care about very minor details between PQ amongst BD players it would be best to wait for a final spec player.

Final spec shouldn't make that much difference (given final spec players are due shortly). PQ will probably continue to improve as the various video chips and firmware continue to evolve (encoding and decoding).

(Not as drastically as 1st generation DVD vs current DVD, but should be some improvements.)

Posted: **Sat Jan 19, 2008 11:54 pm**

About the PS3 fan noise - it seems to have some kind of internal thermometer or something because when I put it in a cabinet it got really hot and the fan got really loud but when I took it out and put it on the floor to cool off the fan slowly became quieter and quieter until it was barely noticeable.

Posted: **Sun Jan 20, 2008 3:03 am**

Gigi M. wrote:
Donald Brown wrote:Then I recommend you get it serviced.
I think is because I have it place on top off my receiver and is not getting much air. A couple of friends of mine also have the same problem, so who knows. Anyway, it doesn't bother me at all since I always have the volume so load that I don't even hear it.

I was just about to amend my previous post to suggest you make sure you have your PS3 in a place where it's receiving adequate air-flow and isn't up against other components. It's a very quiet machine when well ventilated, but placing it on a hot receiver would account for its fan kicking into high gear. But as you note, even then it shouldn't be very audible when you're actually playing or watching something.

Luke M wrote:I think if you actually care about very minor details between PQ amongst BD players it would be best to wait for a final spec player.

Nonsense. The 2.0 spec has absolutely nothing to do with PQ, nor does the 1.1 spec. These are simply to allow access to more features, like PiP and web-dependent extras.

Posted: **Tue Jan 22, 2008 5:37 pm**

It's funny, the "Spec 2.0" scaremongering pops up every few months - right now I'm arguing with someone on an industry board who swears that when the finalized specs are released people with older Blu-Ray players aren't going to be able to play new discs. Maybe I'm just a skeptical person, but how does it make any sense that Sony would alienate all of Blu-Ray's early adopters?

Posted: **Tue Jan 22, 2008 6:14 pm**

Regarding "where am I getting this stuff about loud PS3 fan-noise and the Panny BD30 having better video quality"... all of this is derived from reviewing various threads on the avsforum, including direct comparisons from a variety of early adopters comparing all the well-known players (Robert George, among many others). Here's one of the earliest reviews from a customer who's tried out the following standalones: Samsung BD1000, Panasonic BD10, Sony BD500, Samsung BD1400, Pioneer 95 - and returned them all in favor of keeping the PS3. That is, until he tested the Panny.

Generally speaking, the folks at avsforum still consider the PS3 to be among a very small handful of the very best players, probably the best value going (particularly for gamers), potentially upgradeable via firmware revisions, and likely the fastest, smoothest operator. But many are put off by the fan noise, and none who are in a position to compare claim the video quality is as good as the latest Panny (or latest Sony standalones, but these have other operational issues - slow navigations, freezeups, etc. - that the Panny seems to be relatively free of). Also, check out the "Help a guy pick out a BD Player" sticky thread here.

(Edited to fix broken link)

Posted: **Tue Jan 22, 2008 8:18 pm**

I've always thought of my PS3 as being generally quiet-to-mild, and it's sitting on top of a TiVo, but I may have lost perspective since my Xbox 360 sounds like a commercial jet's hiding somewhere in my media cabinet...

Posted: **Wed Jan 23, 2008 5:14 pm**

If you thought the format war couldn't get lamer, it just did. From IMDB:

Petition Calls on Warner Bros. To Continue HD DVD Releases

Some 6,000 persons have signed an online petition originally posted on January 5th calling for Warner Bros. to reverse its decision to abandon the HD DVD high-definition video format and go exclusively with Blu-ray. The petition refers to HD DVD's lower hardware cost and its alleged "better technological capabilities." A counter "Let HD DVD Die" petition, seemingly aimed at Paramount/DreamWorks and Universal, has also been posted and has drawn over 1,000 signatures.

How much do you want to bet the signatures aren't from users, but from people in either camp. Ridiculous.

Posted: **Wed Jan 23, 2008 6:11 pm**

Antoine Doinel wrote:How much do you want to bet the signatures aren't from users, but from people in either camp. Ridiculous.

Perhaps if the petition was accompanied by a matching cash offer to whatever Warner was paid to "Go Blu" it would be a different story. (sorry, as a Univ. of Michigan grad "Go Blue" has quite a different meaning!)

Posted: **Wed Jan 23, 2008 9:20 pm**

unclehulot wrote:Perhaps if the petition was accompanied by a matching cash offer to whatever Warner was paid to "Go Blu" it would be a different story. (sorry, as a Univ. of Michigan grad "Go Blue" has quite a different meaning!)

And since no one has been able to link the "reported" payoff to a reliable source other than reporting the "reported" "report", as it as the case with the red enthusiast from a little known OH newspaper whose writings are now completely reversed, I must rightfully conclude that indeed the WB petition is quite naive to say the least.

Time to move on the next level and stop looking for water where the majority of consumers now see a desert.

Donald Brown wrote:
Luke M wrote:I think if you actually care about very minor details between PQ amongst BD players it would be best to wait for a final spec player.
Nonsense. The 2.0 spec has absolutely nothing to do with PQ, nor does the 1.1 spec. These are simply to allow access to more features, like PiP and web-dependent extras.

Agreed 100%. Pic quality has absolutely nothing to do with profile 2.0. It should be obvious for obvious reasons.

Posted: **Sat Jan 26, 2008 2:17 am**

Donald Brown wrote:
Luke M wrote:I think if you actually care about very minor details between PQ amongst BD players it would be best to wait for a final spec player.
Nonsense. The 2.0 spec has absolutely nothing to do with PQ, nor does the 1.1 spec. These are simply to allow access to more features, like PiP and web-dependent extras.

Of course the PQ has nothing to do with the spec. I just figured if you are going to shop around for the best BD player it might be better to wait until the specs are finalized because if you were going to buy a BD player that cannot be upgraded, well, that would suck.

Posted: **Mon Feb 11, 2008 4:52 pm**

Netflix drops HD-DVD in favour of Blu-ray

Industry has already picked winner of hi-def battle, says rental service

Netflix has announced that it will be phasing out HD-DVD movies in favour of Sony's Blu-ray format, stating that the movie industry has already chosen a winner in the battle of hi-definition formats.

Movies on HD-DVD, developed by Toshiba, will be dropped from the online rental service by the end of the year, with the company stating the format war has been damaging to consumers.

"The prolonged period of competition between two formats has prevented clear communication to the consumer regarding the richness of the high-def experience versus standard definition," commented chief content officer Ted Sarandos.

"We're now at the point where the industry can pursue the migration to a single format, bring clarity to the consumer and accelerate the adoption of high-def.

"Going forward, we expect that all of the studios will publish in the Blu-ray format and that the price points of high-def DVD players will come down significantly. These factors could well lead to another decade of disc-based movie watching as the consumer's preferred means," he said.

Microsoft backed Toshiba's HD-DVD format for the Xbox 360, launching a movie playing peripheral, but the company has never released uptake figures and has slashed the price of the device on a number of occasions since launch.

Sony's PlayStation 3 is built around the Blu-ray format, with the company clearly stating that Blu-ray would be the key differentiator between the two home consoles.

Netflix claims to be the world's largest movie rental business with more than seven million subscribers accessing over 90,000 titles. It currently stocks around 400 Blu-ray movies.

"From the Netflix perspective, focusing on one format will enable us to create the best experience for subscribers who want high- definition to be an important part of how they enjoy our service," added Sarandos.

Sony Pictures Home Entertainment, Warner Home Video, Twentieth Century Fox Home Entertainment and Buena Vista Home Entertainment all endorse the Blu-ray format.

Paramount Home Entertainment and Universal Studios Home Entertainment have backed HD-DVD.

Posted: **Fri Feb 15, 2008 4:15 pm**

Well, if Warner and then the NetFlix/Best Buy stuff didn't kill the format, this should really do it.

Wal-Mart now dropping HD DVD in June.

I keep hoping to read about Toshiba just giving up, and then I hope places will start severely discounting software to clear stock. If I could find discs for less than $10 a piece, I'd pick up a few.

Posted: **Fri Feb 15, 2008 4:27 pm**

The Reporter says Toshiba to drop HD DVD format.

Posted: **Fri Feb 15, 2008 8:39 pm**

Alright, it looks then like we can finally put this debate to bed once and for all.

Meanwhile, I am debating whether to pick up a standalone HD-DVD player or Xbox 360 add-on with the full suite of HD-DVD exclusives during the ensuing firesale, or wait for the inevitable Blu-Ray re-release. The prices say yes, but my media center is already overflowing and in danger of overheating if I stack any more hot devices on top of each other...

Posted: **Fri Feb 15, 2008 11:48 pm**

davebert wrote:Alright, it looks then like we can finally put this debate to bed once and for all.

eh... that's just rumor. The company has denied it. Whatever the case, you have to imagine that there may still be plenty of time between the actual death and paramount/universal switching over (and then you have the idea that they both might die in light of digital download). I suppose for now crit. could start doing BD for their non-paramount/universal titles (provided their license allows it - strange, I wonder if their licenses would allow Paramount BDs.. hmm).

Posted: **Fri Feb 15, 2008 11:53 pm**

Once again, I'm pretty sure that the decision for Criterion and other indie labels to enter the HD fray hinges more on market penetration than a winning format. Don't hold your breath.

Posted: **Sat Feb 16, 2008 12:43 am**

Ok...now when can we expect Ozu on Blu-ray?

Posted: **Sat Feb 16, 2008 3:17 am**

given the far greater licensing and manufacturing costs involved in Blu-ray, you can expect the indie labels to hold off on their releases for a while yet...

Posted: **Sat Feb 16, 2008 5:46 pm**

Samsung sued over "defective" first-gen Blu-ray players.

Posted: **Sat Feb 16, 2008 7:21 pm**

Toshiba pulling the plug on HD DVD already? - Yup it's over.

From Reuters:

Toshiba Corp is planning to give up on its HD DVD format for high-definition video, conceding defeat to the competing Blu-Ray technology backed by Sony, a company source said on Saturday.

Japanese public broadcaster NHK had earlier reported that Toshiba would suffer losses in the tens of billions of yen (hundreds of millions of dollars) as it scrapped production of HD DVD players and recorders and took other steps to exit the business.

The company source told Reuters that Toshiba was in the final stages of planning to exit the HD DVD business and that an official decision would be made soon.

Posted: **Sat Feb 16, 2008 10:36 pm**

It is not at all surprising that the classics lineup for HD or BR isn't that exciting. The biggest hurdle the manufacturer's and studios now have is in showing the public just why they should invest money in upgrading their systems. Releasing a bunch of classics that will look - at best - marginally better won't cut it. Effects or digital heavy films that certainly look much crisper in HD will be the selling point and that will be where the studios will focus many of their releases until they even consider going back into their catalogs and re-releasing classics in hi-def. It makes no sense financially for someone like Warner's to go back and re-release their DVD classic catalog in hi-def.

Until the cost of manufacturing comes down, and the format takes off, niche film categories will be woefully neglected.

Posted: **Sat Feb 16, 2008 10:58 pm**

Good point, but do we really need to watch classic black and white films in Hi-Def?

Posted: **Sat Feb 16, 2008 11:06 pm**

davidhare wrote:As for classics nothing will happen until Criterion or MoC really get into Blu production - if ever, prior to a real HD dowloadable era.

but Casablanca is available... Isn't that enough? I mean I just want to watch Transformers in its preferred format... that blue thing.

Posted: **Sat Feb 16, 2008 11:29 pm**

Cinephrenic wrote:Good point, but do we really need to watch classic black and white films in Hi-Def?

Speaking only for myself: Yes indeed.

Take The Seventh Seal for example. Even when I played it on my 22" CRT monitor, the difference was quite devastating -- the improvement in details just left me in awe when compared to the Criterion.

On smaller sets compression artifacts aren't that much of a problem, but when moving up in size the result can in certain cases be something of an unholy mess, leaving quite a distracting effect throughout the film. Whether a film is 5 or 50 years old, traces of compression will always be present when presented on a DVD. I wouldn't say the lack of resolution is the biggest problem DVD has, but the amount of compression a film has to go through in order to be fitted on the disc.

And as always: A shitty print that lacks resolution, details etc. will result in an equally shitty digital presentation, whether it be in SD or HD. So no, a HD presentation will not always be a jaw-dropping experience, but at least the level of compression will be greatly reduced.

Posted: **Sun Feb 17, 2008 12:19 am**

Bah, who put off my sarcasmatron?!

I should've known better, but since there has been numerous people making similar statements in this thread without the intention of making some kind of joke, this one slipped me by.

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