criterionforum.org

I'll get the gun

*axe

To the list of titles that probably won't get a BR, I'm going to add Brand Upon the Brain. That film is practically anti-HD.

To my knowledge, the titles that originate on video are Fishing with John, Tanner 88, Hoop Dreams, Beastie Boys (partly shot on film, but the masters are video), Golden Age of TV (tape copies of films shot off a TV monitor), a couple of the Pedro Costa films, Symbiopsycho 2 1/2, and some of Allan King's (though that's Eclipse).

Also, for some reason, I believe Criterion's release of The Harder They Come came from a tape master, but that's a moot point on many levels.

I've seen countless assertions here that it's possible to sell one's Criterion DVDs for roughly the same price as it costs to buy them on Blu-ray at the cheapest available price, which is typically during the semi-annual B&N sales (upwards of $18 with a membership). So, given the lowest* current Amazon Marketplace prices below, and considering that Amazon takes their cut of a few dollars, I'm wondering how I can do this many upgrades without spending lots of new money (which is fair enough) on titles I already have. Any ideas?
*Granted I might be able to get a slightly larger amount for DVDs listed as "Very Good" or "Like New" than the lowest prices, which are often for "Good" or "Acceptable," but very often the prices for items in better condition are quite close to the lowest overall price, regardless of condition.

Yi Yi $9.97
Sweetie $6.89
Smiles of a Summer Night $8.95
Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas $3.51
Cercle Rouge $12.48
Diabolique $9.42
Solaris $8.00
Fat Girl $10.96

I don't necessarily want to upgrade all of these, but I wanted to list all the forthcoming titles I could think of. A newly released upgrade, Robinson Crusoe on Mars, is still priced at around $25 on DVD, amazingly enough, but I don't really want to own that one on any format.

FWIW, I have noticed over the past 3-5 months that Criterion DVDs are finally starting to lose their resale value, which is a shame for this faux-exchange program that people (including myself) assert. I myself have been a leading advocate of selling the DVD and upgrading to BD for under $5 pretty much all year round (not just B&N time).

Besides Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas, many of those on that list were being sold "Like New" for close to $20 on Amazon up to 6 months ago. Some of the older titles (like Diabolique), this wasn't true of course.

Basically, the window is closing at this point as BD becomes a more dominate force and DVD moves closer into obsolescence. The market is disappearing. It was a good run while it lasted.

Gregory wrote: I'm wondering how I can do this many upgrades without spending lots of new money (which is fair enough) on titles I already have. Any ideas?

You've got to sell them early, like when an upgrade is first rumored. I sold my Solaris in early January for $19 (before Amazon's cut). After the Blu-ray is announced, more people want to trade up.

But some discs just don't hold value; since Fear and Loathing is/was CC's best-selling title for a long time, I'm sure that there's a huge supply. On the other hand, can't figure out why there would be so many copies of Yi Yi or Smiles on the secondary market.

jedgeco wrote:You've got to sell them early

To expand my post on this point, at one point you didn't have to do this. I was selling many CC DVDs for $19-$24 after I bought the BD over the past two years. Then, as the market began to collapse, you had to sell it at the announcement, then at the rumor, then.... well, here we are.

Additionally though, the ones you've pointed out are less popular and/or older titles that lost their resale value a while ago. I use eBay to sell these off, just sold Solaris to someone in Denmark for $18.50.

jedgeco wrote:You've got to sell them early, like when an upgrade is first rumored.

I have done this, but it's often risky and usually requires a lot of patience. If I've learned anything from reading rumors on the forum over the years it's that they come to fruition a lot of the time, but about as often (or even more often?) never do happen or take 2-3 years longer than we expect, even when they're from pretty solid statements from Ask Mulvaney or Criterion's Facebook. Fortunately, I avoided the temptation to sell off Contempt and Ran. I think aox is probably right that the market for these DVDs has really changed, and that it was a good run while it lasted.

mfunk9786 wrote:Additionally though, the ones you've pointed out are less popular and/or older titles that lost their resale value a while ago.

I just listed all the forthcoming Blu-ray upgrades, so I guess "less popular and/or older titles" describes most of what they upgrade.

I use eBay to sell these off, just sold Solaris to someone in Denmark for $18.50.

I usually feel like I don't have time for doing eBay auctions, and have often gotten no bids or a low closing bid, but maybe I should consider trying again.

Gregory wrote:I have done this, but it's often risky and usually requires a lot of patience.

Totally agree. Although I find myself with a lot more patience these days than I used to; I've started waiting for most discs to show up used for ~50% of retail or wait for the B&N sales, so getting my hands on discs immediately has dropped in priority for me. (Actually, I've found that my (formerly compulsive) DVD purchasing habits changed significantly during the period that I didn't want to buy DVDs while waiting for Blu-ray to catch on.)

With regard to selling off older titles on Ebay i tend to stick to the "buy it now" category, it takes a little longer to sell but you do get a set price in the end, it can take up to 30 days for some titles, i have just sold the Yojimbo / Sanjuro box set for £30.00 plus shipping to someone in Quebec.

I agree with aox that the party may be over, although I still think eBay can be something of a schizophrenic beast. I recently upgraded five discs to blu (8 1/2, Playtime, Kagemusha, M, and Days of Heaven), and managed, between the five, to fetch just over the cost of three blus direct from Criterion. Some of these sold for way less than I would have liked -- I seem to recall Heaven pulled in ten bucks, maybe even less -- but others, like Playtime, balanced it out. Right time and place, I guess.

Granted, having to shell sixty bucks out of pocket to replace the five hardly seems like it can be called a victory (especially when trying to justify the purchases to my spouse).

Gregory wrote:I've seen countless assertions here that it's possible to sell one's Criterion DVDs for roughly the same price as it costs to buy them on Blu-ray at the cheapest available price, which is typically during the semi-annual B&N sales (upwards of $18 with a membership). So, given the lowest* current Amazon Marketplace prices below, and considering that Amazon takes their cut of a few dollars, I'm wondering how I can do this many upgrades without spending lots of new money (which is fair enough) on titles I already have. Any ideas?
*Granted I might be able to get a slightly larger amount for DVDs listed as "Very Good" or "Like New" than the lowest prices, which are often for "Good" or "Acceptable," but very often the prices for items in better condition are quite close to the lowest overall price, regardless of condition.

Yi Yi $9.97
Sweetie $6.89
Smiles of a Summer Night $8.95
Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas $3.51
Cercle Rouge $12.48
Diabolique $9.42
Solaris $8.00
Fat Girl $10.96

I don't necessarily want to upgrade all of these, but I wanted to list all the forthcoming titles I could think of. A newly released upgrade, Robinson Crusoe on Mars, is still priced at around $25 on DVD, amazingly enough, but I don't really want to own that one on any format.

A lot of these- Diabolique, Fear and Loathing, Sweetie, and Fat Girl in particular- have been cheap for a long time, so it's not really a matter of timing when you sell them. For those, there's no way you're going to make reasonable money online for them unless you put them somewhere like ebay and get lucky.

For the others, the time when the blu is announced is actually the worst time to sell. You're actually better off if you wait until after the blu is released, and the flood of upgraders has burned off a bit.

You're more screwed generally for releases like Solaris and Diabolique where they change the DVD edition as well, since there aren't many people who would opt for the old DVD at that point and a lot of people who don't want the blu will still sell their copy, but I would guess that Solaris might wind up being a special case.

I don't know that the Criterion market is depressed overall. It fluxes a lot, and everything sells slower during B&N sales, but I'd say that for the most part they hover around the same value overall- but there's always ten or twenty that are hardly worth anything, often for no readily apparent reason.

I've had a lot of good trades on Amazon Marketplace: just yesterday I sold my DVD copy of Yi Yi for just over £14. Once you deduct Amazon's commission, I'm left with about £12 so I only need to spend £7-8 on the Blu.

Sorry if this has been discussed before, but Solaris on Blu-Ray doesn't appear in the "coming soon" section.

If I want to see it, I have to type the title and, yes it is still available for preorder. Is it "normal" ? I'm afraid that this title, for a reason or another could be deleted...

Rupert Pupkin wrote:Sorry if this has been discussed before, but Solaris on Blu-Ray doesn't appear in the "coming soon" section

It's a glitch. If you check the "Show Out-of-Print Titles" box, it shows up. Maybe they applied the "out of print" status across the board instead of to just the current DVD version?

Do you think Criterion will ever release another DVD-only mainline title?

Jun-Dai wrote:Do you think Criterion will ever release another DVD-only mainline title?

Anything shot on video, obviously.

No. If the materials at hand aren't good enough to warrant a HD upgrade and the title in question can be bundled with something else (I'm specifically thinking of The Island of Lost Souls and one or two other Uni titles they allegedly got the rights to), they're certain to shove it into the Eclipse line.

Ne Pas Rien will probably just get a standalone DVD

I honestly believe their move towards blu ray has had a negative effect on what they've chosen to release. If every single one of their new additions to the main line is going to be a blu ray release, it requires them to make more financially viable choices. I simply think we'd have some more interesting releases if they were willing to continue releasing DVD-only releases. Don't get me wrong, there have been some great blu ray releases from criterion, such as Vivre Sa Vie, Red Desert, and the stunning Pierrot Le Fou transfer, along with maybe half a dozen others, but by and large, their catalog of films that's only available on DVD is far more interesting in my opinion. I doubt filmmakers like Frantisek Vlacil or Hong Sang soo would receive blu ray treatment, but because criterion is entirely bent on releasing every new film on blu ray, it limits what they're able to release while simultaneously staying in business. We would have never seen the likes of Dillinger Is Dead or Pedro Costa be released if Criterion back then had determined to release everything on blu, although I'm sure films like The Exterminating Angel and Two or Three Things I know About Her would have have received blu ray treatment if they were released today.

The eclipse line exists for a reason and I'm sure they'll make exceptions when need be. Anyways I find some of their releases since the switch to blu to be more daring than the stuff they released from five-ten years previous.

Dillinger Is Dead got a 35mm theatrical reissue. Wouldn't that require more resources than a Blu release?

I never understood why they went DVD-only for that title.

rrenault, there's a lot of talk about this mostly in the speculation thread going back a number of years. If you're just talking about mass cult films vs big name and contemporary stuff, the dominate opinion seemed to be that with the DVD market slowing way down and the majors moving towards non-physical media Criterion just has a much wider pool to choose from at the moment. So instead of putting out nothing but Hausus and The Magicians they're now mixing in Paths of Glorys and Still Walkings.

Regarding Dillinger, someone was theorizing that some of the last DVD-only titles were probably done or near done when they decided to go all blu-ray all the time. And, theatrically, its $8000, vs Hausu's $140 000, may have played into the decision.

Yes, but Still Walking does not seem like it would be significantly more popular than The Magician and House. It's a pretty obscure title, UNLIKE Paths of Glory.