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it actually points to a basic process error - before investing a lot of time & money in a new BR release, if a fault like this arises, Criterion should at least review some of the previous DVD releases to see if it exists there also... But actually ProB points to what may be the great unknown in the woodpile, when the transfer was made? - it's billed as a new HD transfer, not 2K or 4K, and the release is slated at a lower tier price than normal, I guess that's not happened for a while... That said, having a lot of time for De Santis (he's kind of the lost major figure of NeoRealism, but utterly interesting), I'm really looking forward to receiving this release, warts (briefly stuttering visuals) and all!...

domino harvey wrote:He flat out stated that it had to be a disc mastering error

To be precise, he did not write it had to be a DISC mastering error, but only a mastering error, meaning when the master was prepped up (also because I guess he would otherwise have used the phrasing "authoring error", like on the 1st pressing of ZFE for instance).

His 4th point makes it clear to me that to him, the frames should be present in the Criterion disc. Otherwise, he wouldn't have made 3 other points, he would simply have quoted Criterion's answer as a "this settles the matter" response.

Finally, his 3rd point seems to me to replicate what you're saying : the issue probably is on the master that was struck [and used then by Criterion].

missing frames being missing from the 'original film element' used for this BD master is not saying that frames are missing on every film element, eg one that was used for the dvd. I dont really see how that means that someone made a choice to omit them.

You're right, whoever did the master might simply not have done his homework (which is indeed a possibility my previous doesn't reflect).

Guys, do recall that the "battered print/inter-neg" you're bashing is:

"This new high-definition transfer was created on a Spirit DataCine film scanner from the 35mm original camera negative.

Thus adding further questions/confusion!

cdnchris wrote: EDIT: and someone on Blu-ray.com actually was able to post the scene from Hulu: http://forum.blu-ray.com/showpost.php?p ... stcount=15" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I've uploaded the scene in question from the Cristaldi DVD, if you'd like to compare it to the Criterion version.

My two cents: The negative was damaged at some point after a few positive prints were made, one of which was probably the source of the Cristaldi DVD, and Criterion felt more comfortable leaving in the damage (that is, the missing frames) rather than mix footage from two different sources.

Just to say I received this on BR yesterday and it really is a very nice transfer indeed, plus I found the very brief hiccup not too distracting at all...

As always, pro-b is just deliberately twisting both facts and phrasing to hide his own mistakes and foolishly try to keep the upper hand.

Obviously, Criterion is NOT saying that those frames are missing from the film to begin with, just that they are missing from the original film element their master was struck from. There was no flaw during the mastering process, the flaw was already on the film print used.

Could there be any other film print containing those missing frames? Of course.

Could Pro-B ever admit any of his many, many mistakes over his colossal hubris? Of course not.

Original release artwork for RISO AMARO (reproduced in a Lux publicity brochure), two striking gouaches for the film by noted leftist painter Renato Guttuso...

For some reason I only now connected that Silvana Mangano in this movie is the same Silvana Mangano that was in all those Pasolini movies, where she was alluring in a completely different way. Also, she is apparently the grandmother of Giada from the Food Network!

Is it her or Dino De Laurentiis we have to blame for "Moo-sah-rellah"?

I found this a really fascinating entertaining film. An odd hybrid of neo-realist (farm) worker drama and film noir/crime film. They even manage to slip in some erotically charged music/dancing scenes. I think the great cast really makes this work so well. I was a bit surprised by the degree of sexuality on display here, especially for a film about migrant farm workers. And somehow the women walking around barefoot most of the time added to that. It's also impressive that the film primarily focuses on women and their hardships, and the final denouement involves both men suffering serious arm injuries, so the women wind up with the guns and determining the final outcome.

Was great to finally see this. I bought a public domain version roughly a dozen years ago, which didn't contain English subtitles, so I only watched 5 or 10 minutes and really had no idea what to expect. A few of the scenes -- the initial dancing, the sluice busting -- were familiar from Scorsese's appreciation of post-war Italian films.
Might as well add that I didn't notice the few seconds with missing frames which has consumed almost the whole discussion of the film here. I can definitely see returning to this again in a few years. I hope to see more De Santis films.

ellipsis7 wrote: Mon Jan 25, 2016 10:16 am Original release artwork for RISO AMARO (reproduced in a Lux publicity brochure), two striking gouaches for the film by noted leftist painter Renato Guttuso...

Honestly would kind of prefer this to the fold out essay art we got.

a decade later, color me stunned that Janus has unveiled a new trailer for a 4K restoration. I will be really impressed if Criterion upgrades this

This would be a neat upgrade. The blu looks good but there is def room for improvement.

Mr.DarjeelingLimited wrote: Fri Jan 09, 2026 7:09 pm This would be a neat upgrade. The blu looks good but there is def room for improvement.

Yes, an upgrade to 4K UHD + Blu Ray combo would be merited certainly...

It seems to be touring. This is playing at NY’s Film Forum end of January into February. Look for the upgrade later in the year.

worth nothing that De Santis' Roma Ore 11 has also been restored - we speculated on it being a title Radiance might do, so I wonder if it's of interest to Criterion as well. would make for a great simultaneous release like the Kon Ichikawa titles in August (and equally as miraculous, I still never expected Criterion to actually follow through on those upgrades)

This is a terrific movie but wasn’t this one of their budget Blu-rays? Have they upgraded any of those?

I watched Giuseppe De Santis' film before this, Tragic Hunt, and it's just as raw and thrilling a piece of rural noir as its follow-up, if less operatic. Some of the violence is shocking (the treatment of one medical patient in particular!), as is the animated nature of the core female Nazi villain, and I loved the intensity and lived-in nature of all the characters - you feel their variant motivators as deeply authentic and high stakes, including the moral relativity of one critical principal who'd be resigned to clearcut villain status in a lesser film. The weight of every decision is felt, all while keeping this primarily a piece of genre entertainment with regularly unexpected narrative pivots. Highly recommended for fans of Bitter Rice

Non c'è pace tra gli ulivi is going to be released soon by Studio Canal in Make my Day collection.

Tragic Hunt is good, but it's too much 40s communist idealistic peace and justice idea of PCI.
If I talk about it, I would be banned. The same reasons for Riso Amaro, I don't know how it passed to America on the Red Hunting.
Is it called Red Witch Hunting?

Rome ore 11 is very very very good.

Un marito per Anna Zaccheo is not good.There's a RAI documentary on the Italian DVD about De Santis. Probably directed by Lizzani, I can not confirm this because I saw it many years ago.

Giorni d'amore the film is ok, may be too corny, it was restored and released in France by Carlota, nice blu ray.
But not extras at all

Uomini and Lupi, I didn't like at all. There was an Italian user in the house that thinks it was the response to Ford's The Searchers, a great forum user, I've read his articles on Italian books: Matarazzo's one, Titanus cinema book. Grazzie.

The Road a Year Long has surfaced on youtube some time ago, one of the worst prints I've suffered in my life. Too much red and optimistic. I don't know how it won the Golden Globe.

Italiani brava gente is on DVD in Italy, it's a very interesting picture. I've seen twice.

The films I haven't seen are La garçonnière and the last one, Un apprezzato professionista di sicuro avvenire