Film Noir suggestions

[Floyd]

It gets worse Daumier no one mentioned the best 'film noir' there is..

The Big Heat

Some others, some already mentioned but I adore them so much I am saying them again

Kiss Me Deadly
Gun Crazy
The Lady from Shanghai
The Killing (I don't think this got mentioned somehow either)
Humphrey Bogart noirs

[porquenegar]

I've enjoyed most of the current Fox Film Noir series. I think there are 12 out of 24 available now. I recently viewed Whirlpool (Preminger) - 1949 and Somewhere in the Night ( J. Mankiewicz) - 1946

Whirlpool was a lot of fun. Jose Ferrer plays such a terrific cool villain. Somewhere in the Night is a bit more silly being a basic amnesia plot but the writing is pretty good.

The better known Laura and Nightmare Alley are also in the series but you've probably already seen them. I personally don't like the docu-noir stuff so some of the films like Kiss of Death and Street with No Name weren't to my taste.

[essrog]

I'm on a noir kick, too, having just finished Warner set No. 2 -- Born to Kill and Crossfire are the two essentials from that collection, I think. I also recently watched Force of Evil -- Scorsese has touted this as a major influence on him, so I'm not sure if this counts as a lesser-known gem or not. But if you haven't seen it, it's definitely worth picking up -- the photography, acting and plot reinforce what writer/director Abraham Polonsky called "the anxiety caused by the system."

[rwaits]

I remember looking over the Eclipse thread close to a year ago and seeing an enthusiastic request for Blast of Silence (guessing it was you, milkcan?) It prompted me to do a little reading on the film, and eventually check it out. What a recommendation--amazing film. The dialogue is about as hard boiled as it comes, the sets evoking an eerie emptiness, and the acting pretty great, considering. Anyone interested in tough crime dramas inspired by noir should definitely seek this one out. Milkcan, more recommendations like Blast of Silence would be appreciated!

[pzman84]

I hope Sony released the much underrated The Sniper (1952) soon. It is a great film, way ahead of its time.

[Ashirg]

Not Sony.

They eff-ing released Knock on Any Door, Tight Spot and Human Desire back in 2004 in 2 very expensive boxsets that included titles available in region 1. Human Desire is also available in Spain, but 2 other are still to be released in any other country on DVD.

[milkcan]

A film noir that I can honestly say is one of my favorites is Allen Baron's 1961 masterpiece Blast of Silence. It is a film that burnt itself into my mind: perhaps it was a result of the "unofficial" DVD I saw, but the film has a hazy, old look to it that compliments Baron's sleazy, low-down, hood story well. The music is exceptional. Lionel Stander's vocals are priceless, and the narration is perfect (among one of the very best, too).

There are several films you could cite as having influenced director/star/writer Allen Baron, but I can't find anything blatant. The film is in a class of its own - even with its (minimal) low-budget/B-Grade flaws.

I am very interested to know some background information on this. Baron created a very particular story about a hate-filled hitman that comes across as if it were real. I once read they had an actor to play the main character, but due to financial reasons, Baron took over and played it.

It's a film not to be missed, and someone (anyone!) needs to release this gem on DVD soon!

I remember looking over the Eclipse thread close to a year ago and seeing an enthusiastic request for Blast of Silence (guessing it was you, milkcan?) It prompted me to do a little reading on the film, and eventually check it out. What a recommendation--amazing film. The dialogue is about as hard boiled as it comes, the sets evoking an eerie emptiness, and the acting pretty great, considering. Anyone interested in tough crime dramas inspired by noir should definitely seek this one out. Milkcan, more recommendations like Blast of Silence would be appreciated!

I am glad you enjoyed the film. "Eerie emptiness" is a great way to describe it.

I don't really have any other recommendations that haven't already been mentioned (or are widely known), and there are still a good deal of titles I need to see. But, Murder by Contract (1958) - which I saw on MoviePlex two years ago - is another hitman movie that I liked. Its often corny and rather comedic, but Vince Edwards is good, the film has a slow, lazy atmosphere to it, and the odd musical score is memorable.

[viciousliar]

The Human Desire disc looks perfectly acceptable in the Spanish edition, even if it's not anamorphic. The subs are removable.

(Erroneously denoted as a 4:3 entry)

http://www.dvdgo.com/product~catgid~0~l ... Desire.htm

[Antoine Doinel]

I can't believe no one has mentioned The Naked City. That really needs to come out on DVD.

[HerrSchreck]

You can't go wrong with Dassin-- don't forget BRUTE FORCE, maybe my favorite Dassin of all (save Rififi, which no one has mentioned).

Someone mentioned STRANGER ON THE THIRD FLOOR way back. This is an under discussed gem. Not sure a dvd even exists. Some of Nick Musaraca's best work, more stylish than OUT OF THE PAST. Another rare, oddball noir (for some reason... I've never heard anyone bring it up though it's a Mann/Alton in the exact visual style as TMEN & RAW DEAL) is set during the French Revolution(!) called THE BLACK BOOK. Another unknown, uncharacteristically naturalistic noir (with a lot of location shooting, rare for Manns crime films) by Mann which I think is getting ready to see the light of day on DVD is SIDE STREET.

Another beautiful little shadowy b-paradise private-dick programmer which has grown on me like crazy is Boetticher's BEHIND LOCKED DOORS.

QUAI DE BRUMES is thrown around as sort've noir-- beautifully depressing film.

And, for the first-ever, actual legitimate film noir in the history of American film-- the all cylinders-turning sinfully-forgotten masterpiece... Wallace Worsleys/Lon Chaney's vicious, brutal, horrible, excellent silent from 1920... THE PENALTY.

[tryavna]

Another rare, oddball noir (for some reason... I've never heard anyone bring it up though it's a Mann/Alton in the exact visual style as TMEN & RAW DEAL) is set during the French Revolution(!) called THE BLACK BOOK.

The Black Book is indeed an oddball in the Mann/Alton series, but it's as brilliantly stylish with its visuals as any more typical noir you can name. As Leonard Maltin puts it, "each shot is a painting!" Sadly, it's slipped into public domain, but TCM shows it off and on under its other title Reign of Terror. Like any of Mann's films, it deserves to be watched.

[rwaits]

Did anyone catch the Academy Awards last night? I'm wondering about the film noir montage that Lauren Bacall presented. The first clip--it was a scene in a darkened motel room at night with a man sitting on a bed. the window was open, and part of the motel sign is displayed--the only letters from the sign you can see spell out the word "KILL." I have never seen this film--can someone tell me what it is?

[ezmbmh]

speaking of which, it was exquisitely painful watching her flub her intro, whether she couldn't see the monitor or health or age. wonderful to see her out there, and the smile at the end was still there--the hardest truest moment of the night.

EZ

[Ashirg]

The first clip--it was a scene in a darkened motel room at night with a man sitting on a bed. the window was open, and part of the motel sign is displayed--the only letters from the sign you can see spell out the word "KILL." I have never seen this film--can someone tell me what it is?

The Unsuspected (1947)

[rwaits]

Came across this upcoming set:


http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000EN ... ance&n=130

10 mostly great films for only $14.99!?! Can anyone comment on the quality of Passport International?

[Ashirg]

Another sucky public domain release. Here's review of their Orson Welles Collection. Criterion it ain't!

[HerrSchreck]

there are good editions out of most of these.

[Fletch F. Fletch]

I ran across this kinda cool site: http://www.tcf.ua.edu/Classes/Jbutler/T ... ations.htm

It also all sorts of screen captures from classic noirs to illustrate examples of Low-Key Lighting, Unconventional Camera Angles, and some neo-noir examples.

[skuhn8]

dvdplanet is offering 3 for 2 on fox titles including the noir series releases. I'm looking for recommendations. The only one I already have is Laura. Limited funds so seeking top notch--ok, polished--titles a la Laura. Lame criteria, I know. Don't know how else to put it.

Considering the following:

Whirlpool
Where the Sidewalk Ends
Nightmare Alley
Fallen Angel

How are Fallen Angel and Whirlpool? Are there better titles in the series that I'm missing?

Also getting Leave Her to Heaven. On a Gene Tierney kick can't you tell.

Help

[rwaits]

Definitely pick up Nightmare Alley--my favorite of the entire series. Another good one, though not on your list, is Panic in the Streets.

[HerrSchreck]

WHIRLPOOL is one of the lesser of the series.

The best of the Fox's are NORTHSIDE 777, HOUSE-92ND ST, NIGHTMARE ALLEY, STREET W NO NAME, DARK CORNER, KISS OF DEATH, WHERE THE SIDEWALK ENDS, LAURA of course.

If I had to pick 3 I'd go w NIGHTMARE ALLEY, KISS OF DEATH, then toss a 3 sided coin between STREET W NO NAME, 777, & HOUSE 92ND.

[skuhn8]

WHIRLPOOL is one of the lesser of the series.

The best of the Fox's are NORTHSIDE 777, HOUSE-92ND ST, NIGHTMARE ALLEY, STREET W NO NAME, DARK CORNER, KISS OF DEATH, WHERE THE SIDEWALK ENDS, LAURA of course.

If I had to pick 3 I'd go w NIGHTMARE ALLEY, KISS OF DEATH, then toss a 3 sided coin between STREET W NO NAME, 777, & HOUSE 92ND.

thanks much for the recommendations. No need for a three sided coin as dvdplanet doesn't carry Northside 777 for some reason. In the end I went for Nightmare Alley, Street with No Name, Kiss of Death and where the Sidewalk Ends. So, again, thanks. But I don't want to turn this into a "at such and such a sale I bought....."

Looking for further help. If one wanted a--well, if not difinitive--let's just say you could only afford to buy one book on Film Noir, what would it be? And I know there is a best books on film thread but I think this is a better place for this.

Also, as far as noir recommendations, I just (re)watched Criss Cross. Wow. That is a masterpiece. I think that, Laura, Touch of Evil, Pickup on South Street and Out of the Past are probably my favorite noirs at the moment. I love The Big Sleep and Maltese Falcon as well, but I don't know. There's something about Bogie that takes me out of the milieu [sic?] that I enjoy so much in noir, that feeling of inevitable doom, as if every word our protagonist says is just a one of a finite number of "last words". I just know that Bogie is going to walk out with little more than a scratch. At worst he'll take a sock to the jaw which will give him an opportunity for a wry comment...or maybe he'll be on the receiving end of a blackjack to help propel the plot. But I love Big Sleep immensely. It just feels different.

[HerrSchreck]

As for the basics, have you seen the two obligatory MANN/ALTON's?

TMEN
RAW DEAL

then of course, the original LE SAMOURAI, HE WALKED BY NIGHT?

I couldn't myself refer you to a noir book. I read very few books on film, unless I'm a real fanatic for something which is very obscure, lacking obvious accessable info. I agree with Welles in his intro to INTOLERANCE where he starts off saying "You know, there is much too much literature out there about literature... and there is mmuuuccchh too much literature about the subject of film. And some books give me credit for all kinds of innovations that I didn't invent-- then others come along and say that I don't deserve the credit.. well I want you to know that I've never once claimed that credit. (Pause) I mention this, because the film we're about to see deserves All The Credit that can possibly be given to it.. it was made just a year after I was born..."

[skuhn8]

As for the basics, have you seen the two obligatory MANN/ALTON's?

TMEN
RAW DEAL

then of course, the original LE SAMOURAI, HE WALKED BY NIGHT?

I confess I haven't seen any of those you mention but that the Mann's are available in a tidy 2-fer. Will have to order.

As for lit.: awhile back the Point Blank thread (under Warners) spun into a talk on film noir and it's "definitions"--mostly focuessed on neo-noir and whether/how we can define films as one or the other. I found this interesting but am more interested in a discussion on the elements of noir. What makes a classic noir. I know about the pulp sources, the wartime conditions and their influence on studio versus location shooting and the resultant lighting, but want to read more about what most all these films have in common and where some the "greater noirs" depart from formula...without of course watching all of them. As much as I would prefer to view all those available I can't afford more than a few titles a month (starving teacher in the sticks blahblahblah).

Why are some noir films better than others (I know on the surface this sounds like a simple if not downright stupid question, but I think there's something there to discuss)? For me the real beauty of the Asphalt Jungle (albeit not one of my favs) is the sunny day in the end with the horses he's dreamed so much about, his old homestead. We know from the beginning that his dream can never be realised but there is something so touching that he at least catches a glimpse before dying. It's as if the studio door is suddenly opened up and we're released from the smoke-filled claustrophobia that we expected to continue until the very end. What I love about Out of the Past it's--well, I guess I'd call it Adventure Noir (cause we need more stupid labels)--freewheeling geographic movement not unlike Welles' Arkadin. One great film can take place almost entirely within the bars of a prison (with only two releases possible: flashbacks to "how I got here" and final execution) while another takes us to the bars of Rio.


Is there a noir formula? And what are the successful departures or divergent nuances that lend themselves to greatness? Or does it all just come down to the remarkable acting?

[HerrSchreck]

I'll step aside for that discussion, because though there were trends here & there, I truly believe labels like "Noir" were invented by critics so that they can organize their viewing into a science to make it sound like serves some greater function than it actually does. I sincerely mean it when I say that. There is no contemporary evidence to indicate that directors of crime-dramas approx 1944-55 had any idea they were doing anything called "Noir", or that there was any qualifiying formula. Most practitioners never heard the term while they were making key films of the genre, and most of them wished they could have been making other pictures as these were mostly B-list pictures. Directors still alive are glad to sit and talk about those pictures today as though they were part of a revolutionary movement, but the fact is back then most of them cast an envious eye on directors of higher grade pictures and were just making the best of fading talent (whom they desperately didn't want to join) and variable-quality scripts. The formula most talk about ("femme fatales, etc") are usually carryovers from detective novel thrillers i e Chandler. What we call Noir represents a period crime melodramas went thru, but certainly shadowy, brutal crime melodramas had been around since the gangster flicks of Chaney in the 20's. Much of "noir" was just a snapshot of the natural progression of certain cinematic "chic"s & dark glamorizations of the street which had been around since the silent/early talkie era. The hats, the gowns, the hardboiled fatlistic men, prisons, the chiaroscuro-- all except the genuine obsession 45-55 with the 'private dick' which again was chandler-- they all have their dispositions in surrounding eras too. Our view today is very nostalgic ex-post facto isolation of what was an ongoing development of the b&w crime drama unconcerned with "feelgood".