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Actually, Gang of Four is one of _my_ favorites (pending a re-watching of everything).

Michael Kerpan wrote:Actually, Gang of Four is one of _my_ favorites (pending a re-watching of everything).

I really have to revisit it, but I remember feeling that something was a bit off about it. It seemed too tightly constructed, in the first half especially, in a way that made it at once too approachable and a bit unsettling for one of his films. Bulle Ogier playing the elusive matriarch of the theater group, however, is truly memorable.

I loved Hurlevent, so maybe opinions on Rivette will tend to run the gamut.

I love Gang of Four as well, as one of that great strong seam of what I think of as 'pure Rivette' films that run through his oeuvre (the paranoid conspiracy / performance troupe ones - I suppose the 'haunted house' ones form another seam). I tend to especially relish Rivette films in that mode (from Paris nous appartient through Va savoir), so this might be yet another subjective quirk.

There's even a few moments of "haunted house" in Gang of Four. ;~}

zedz wrote:I love Gang of Four as well, as one of that great strong seam of what I think of as 'pure Rivette' films that run through his oeuvre (the paranoid conspiracy / performance troupe ones - I suppose the 'haunted house' ones form another seam). I tend to especially relish Rivette films in that mode (from Paris nous appartient through Va savoir), so this might be yet another subjective quirk.

I agree that Rivette's themes have been pretty consistent, and your description pretty much covers them -- theatrical rehearsal, ghost story, conspiracy... I'd add mad love and female comradery. And my enjoyment of the film usually depends on how well one or all of those elements work. Gang of Four's handling of some of those elements seemed to me, at times, a little too obtuse and explicit when compared to his other films (I feel the same way about Paris nous appartient). There was something sleek about it that made it seem more conventional, and less organic than, say, Out 1 or Celine and Julie. Which isn't to say that I didn't enjoy the film, only that its one of my least favorite Rivettes.

Maybe I'm still under its spell, but the Joan films may be Rivette's best in the political conspiracy category.

Well, having revisited "Jeanne" recently thanks to - or despite of - the AE discs, I found it surprising how different from and yet how typical of Rivette these two films were. There's a completely natural flow to them, nothing seems artificial or contrived at all. There certainly is a political conspiracy in "Jeanne", but if never feels thought-out (and of course it wasn't, Rivette simply followed historical facts with the film, much more than other directors). The depth of characterisation and the complete feeling of naturalness, something I always experience with Rivette even in his most over-the-top films, is there to a degree that even he seldom reached in other films. It may have to do with Sandrine Bonnaire, as I have a similar feeling with "Secret Defense". She really makes you feel for this character, and to endow such a half-mythical figure like Jeanne with so much humour and simple humanity, really is the sign of a great, great performance. Nothing against Rivette's direction, but with a different actress, the film most likely would only have been half as great.

Bonnaire is incredible. And its completely a credit to Rivette's direction, or rather his reinvention of the very role of director, that he lets his actors create and make a large piece, or in this case almost all, of the work's virtues. Her Joan has such an authenticity and humanity to her that it seems to instantly dislodge centuries of ideological, transcendental, and political grime from the story.

What surprises me about Joan, although it shouldn't surprise me, is how much it is like his other films. It fits perfectly in a way I never would have imagined it would -- a female protagonist who makes a playground and a battlefield out of a very patriarchal political landscape by manipulating and redefining its symbols and its roles, only to succumb eventually to an established conspiracy of powers. It works perfectly, and the fact that history can be so strangely Rivettian lets the film develop so naturally, as you said.

Elephant wrote:*what the hell was that fight that nearly broke out before the opening short?

Someone got shoved? It wasn't nearly as entertaining as some guy LOUDLY fainting in the middle of the Antichrist screening. They had to stop the film.

As for 36 vues du Pic Saint Loup - good but I didn't get the "I must see this again ASAP" urge I last got with Histoire de Marie et Julien -- IMO Rivette's last masterwork.

Gang of Four is the Rivette film to my eyes

Having seen all his full length films (except his latest), my Top 3 looks like:

1. L'amour Fou
2. Up/Down/Fragile
3. Wuthering Heights

followed closely by Celine and Julie Go Boating and Gang of Four.

:love rivette:

dmk_world wrote: 3. Wuthering Heights

Would love to read the rationale for this ranking

domino harvey wrote: Would love to read the rationale for this ranking

I don't know if its among my own favorites, but I don't see why it shouldn't be. Not to turn the question around, but why is that a shocking choice?

I have to say that I love Rivette, and I love the book...the movie misses out on the things I love from both of them though. Any sympathy is manipulated, and there is no sense of mystery. This is by far my least favorite Rivette, and the one, along with The Nun that I would not willing watch again.

On the other hand, I dislike the book -- and didn't begin to appreciate the film until I disentangled what Rivette was doing from what was derived directly from Bronte's book.

Hurlevent is not one of my top favorites by any means -- but I do think it is one of his most (purely) visually impressive ones.

Dmk listed his favorite as L'amour fou, so the choice seems pretty reasonable to me. They're cut from similar cloth. The visual aspect and setting seems pretty vital in the film, as much as it does in Noroit. As for the novel, I don't care too much for it myself, and beyond what Rivette does by truncating the narrative it doesn't seem too compelling as an adaptation.

Someone on Facebook asked about Out 1:

The Criterion Collection - We thought your post was answered by the person who posted the last big post. The latest is tht we're going to try to get it done, and about seventy-five people on Facebook all agreed to buy 100 copies each. But really, we will get it done, even though it probably won't be our first Rivette....

I rarely use emoticons, but:

tartarlamb wrote:Someone on Facebook asked about Out 1:

The Criterion Collection - We thought your post was answered by the person who posted the last big post. The latest is tht we're going to try to get it done, and about seventy-five people on Facebook all agreed to buy 100 copies each. But really, we will get it done, even though it probably won't be our first Rivette....

I rarely use emoticons, but:

Dear Criterion,

I don't so much care what will be your first Rivette (wild guess: Paris Belongs To Us as it is out in theaters under the Janus banner already) but when will be your first Rivette?

Ted Todorov wrote:I don't so much care what will be your first Rivette (wild guess: Paris Belongs To Us as it is out in theaters under the Janus banner already

I'll be a bit disappointed, but not at all surprised if it is.

Isn't the sadly underrated La religieuse also Janus?

Nope, The Nun is Studio Canal / Lionsgate.

tartarlamb wrote:

Ted Todorov wrote:I don't so much care what will be your first Rivette (wild guess: Paris Belongs To Us as it is out in theaters under the Janus banner already

I'll be a bit disappointed, but not at all surprised if it is.

Isn't the sadly underrated La religieuse also Janus?

That would be fantastic, but I don't remember a Janus logo at La religieuse's MMA screening while Paris did have one.

Damn. But I guess I shouldn't look the gift horse in the mouth.

Ted Todorov wrote:Dera Criterion, I don't so much care what will be your first Rivette (wild guess: Paris Belongs To Us as it is out in theaters under the Janus banner already) but when will be your first Rivette?

Dear So-and-So... Ages.

I'm very excited - I just got my hands on Paris s'en va. I'm watching through it now and it seems like a lot (all?) of the footage is from Pont du Nord and it has narration (by I would have to guess Pascale Ogier). The film is 30 minutes and has the definite uncanny feel for time and place that Rivette brings. It seems like rushes from Pont du Nord with very French sounding music and narration. All in all, something I will enjoy getting into more. Just thought I would post this; as far as I was concerned, this film was close to being a myth. Has anyone else here seen it?

cinemartin wrote:I'm very excited - I just got my hands on Paris s'en va. ... Has anyone else here seen it?

I am sure that many of us here are _very_ envious.

PM me if you have interest. If there is anyone who is fluent in French that feels like doing translations, I would be very grateful.