Edward Yang on DVD

[ltfontaine]

The Chinese name of A Brighter Summer's Day means "Rebel Without a Cause" and it uses the same characters used for Nicholas Ray's film of the same name.

Did Yang, fluent in English, choose the Presley-derived alternate title himself, given the obvious problems, and leaden effect for English-speaking audiences, of calling his film "Rebel Without a Cause?"

[zedz]

Thanks ptmd - so Yang's film is the secret second cousin of Wong's Days of Being Wild! Instant triple feature.

The actual "Are You Lonesome Tonight" lyric is "a bright summer day", but the kids are thrown by Presley's proto-Mark E Smith diction, coming up with the illogical mistranscription (as the lyric is doing a simple night / day comparison, not a slightly cloudy summer day / brighter summer day comparison) - that's why they replay and question the lyrics.

The Chinese name of A Brighter Summer's Day means "Rebel Without a Cause" and it uses the same characters used for Nicholas Ray's film of the same name.

Did Yang, fluent in English, choose the Presley-derived alternate title himself, given the obvious problems, and leaden effect for English-speaking audiences, of calling his film "Rebel Without a Cause?"

My guess is that he chose both titles, with specific resonances in mind for each. The English title is clearly grounded in the film, but as ptmd points out, the Ray / Dean references are also significant (now that you mention it)

[whaleallright]

That reminds me of something I'd been meaning to ask:

What does the Chinese title of Hou's THE TIME TO LIVE AND THE TIME TO DIE mean?

[Lemmy Caution]

The Chinese name of A Brighter Summer's Day means "Rebel Without a Cause"

Well, that's an extremely loose translation.

牯岭街 å°‘å¹´ æ

[ltfontaine]

The actual "Are You Lonesome Tonight" lyric is "a bright summer day", but the kids are thrown by Presley's proto-Mark E Smith diction, coming up with the illogical mistranscription (as the lyric is doing a simple night / day comparison, not a slightly cloudy summer day / brighter summer day comparison) - that's why they replay and question the lyrics.

The lyric is misquoted by various on-line sources, but I'm listening to the recording right now and the phrase is exactly as I've cited it:

Does your memory stray to a brighter summer day / When I kissed you and called you sweetheart?

Presley's diction is clear, even on the film soundtrack, and Yang's English title lifts the line precisely as Elvis sings it. The boys question the lyric not because they can't decipher it, but because they are uncertain whether the phrase is grammatically correct.

The Chinese name of A Brighter Summer's Day means "Rebel Without a Cause"

Well, that's an extremely loose translation.

牯岭街 å°‘å¹´ æ

[Lemmy Caution]

The Chinese name of A Brighter Summer's Day means "Rebel Without a Cause" and it uses the same characters used for Nicholas Ray's film of the same name.

From what I see, this is wrong. Unless there was a different (earlier?) Chinese title at one time.

I don't know what the Chinese is for Rebel Without a Cause, but Brighter Summer Day includes the street name in the title. I've translated it very directly. Not sure how, if at all, the two titles are related.

Just checked and Rebel Without a Cause is æ— å› çš„å

[GringoTex]

But also, even though Hou Hsiao-Hsien got that lovely 4-film box set

Those were some of the worst transfers I've ever seen for newer films. If HHH's own company was responsible for that, then I'm shocked.

[Michael Kerpan]

But also, even though Hou Hsiao-Hsien got that lovely 4-film box set

Those were some of the worst transfers I've ever seen for newer films. If HHH's own company was responsible for that, then I'm shocked.

These were quite decent transfers of unrestored film elements. If these were the worst transfers you've seen you have had a remarkably sheltered cinematic existence.

[ltfontaine]

Those were some of the worst transfers I've ever seen for newer films. If HHH's own company was responsible for that, then I'm shocked.

I was told by someone close to the project that the elements used were the best they could find, probably the best that survive. The motivation was to make the films available, but the time, money, personnel and effort required to undertake restoration of these materials were simply not available. Apparently elements for many of the early films, at least, of the Taiwan new wave were not preserved with much archival foresight.

Anyway, Hou is a filmmaker, not a DVD producer, and the fact that a projected second box set from SinoMovie has never materialized probably indicates his relative level of interest in such endeavors. Given remarks he's made in interviews, it's not clear whether he will even continue to make movies, let alone DVDs.

That first Hou box set from SinoMovie is my favorite DVD fetish item ever.

[Michael Kerpan]

I think there may have been rights issues that slowed down release of the planned second and third HHH box sets.

One is not likely to see better releases of these particular HHH films -- so I treasure the box set too.

[whaleallright]

The transfers on the Hou box were superb. One unfortunate thing is that the producers removed the original credits and replaced them with anonymous-looking new ones.

The first edition packaging is gorgeous, but it makes little sense. If you look closely the cover includes a postcard in English which has no relevance to anything in the films--just a design element. If you read English (and folks who read English were by no means the primary audience for this set) it's distracting and more than a bit odd.

Thanks, Lemmy, for the translation of the Hou title. Almost without exception I prefer the literal English translations of the titles of Hou's films to the ones that were cooked up for international distribution. I can see how Yang (who named the film I believe) thought THE TIME TO LIVE AND THE TIME TO DIE would have some resonance with Western audiences, but it sounds unidiomatic to my ears. CHILDHOOD MEMORIES is more prosaic but more appropriate, especially since the film begins with Hou saying something like, "These are a few memories I have from my childhood...."

[zedz]

Presley's diction is clear, even on the film soundtrack, and Yang's English title lifts the line precisely as Elvis sings it. The boys question the lyric not because they can't decipher it, but because they are uncertain whether the phrase is grammatically correct.

You're making the same mistake as the kids in the film. Yes, Presley adds a little semi-schwa after "bright", and that's the entire point of the confusion over the lyric. Maybe Presley even thought the line was "brighter summer day", but it ain't. The song had been around since the twenties, and I don't think anybody pre-Presley made that particular lyrical slip (which Yang's kids are smart enough to notice doesn't make sense but is nevertheless confusingly there on Presley's recording) - treat yourself to the Carter Family's rendition for corroboration.

[ptmd]

I don't know what the Chinese is for Rebel Without a Cause, but Brighter Summer Day includes the street name in the title. I've translated it very directly. Not sure how, if at all, the two titles are related.

It's possible that I'm completely wrong about this, but I was told that it was a direct reference to the Chinese title of Rebel Without a Cause by a personal friend of the Yang family and a Taiwanese friend of mine confirmed that the resonance was there. Perhaps it is indeed a reference to an earlier title of the Ray film? Or maybe they were just talking about an earlier title for Yang's film, since it did undergo several serious revisions during the five years he was working on it. Still, I got the very clear impression that the link between the two films, which is clear enough in the film, was embedded in the title.

[Lemmy Caution]

Well, as it stands the present titles for the two films are completely different.

Rebel Without a Cause is translated literally into Chinese as "No Reason (Cause) To Rebel"
or Rebelling Without Cause.

It could have had some other Chinese title in Taiwan, which Brighter Summer Day might have referenced slightly.

In any case, thanks for the insight that Yang was essentially making a Taiwanese version of the well-known American film.

[ltfontaine]

You're making the same mistake as the kids in the film. Yes, Presley adds a little semi-schwa after "bright", and that's the entire point of the confusion over the lyric. Maybe Presley even thought the line was "brighter summer day", but it ain't. The song had been around since the twenties, and I don't think anybody pre-Presley made that particular lyrical slip (which Yang's kids are smart enough to notice doesn't make sense but is nevertheless confusingly there on Presley's recording) - treat yourself to the Carter Family's rendition for corroboration.

I'm well acquainted with the Carter Family rendition of “Are You Lonesome Tonightâ€

[zedz]

I actually don't think we're that much in disagreement: Elvis gets the lyric wrong, the boys follow his lead, but are confused by his error. I'm not disputing that Elvis' RCA recording sounds the way it does (though I don't know how you can tell for sure that the extra syllable is a deliberate variation and NOT a slip, just as the Carter Family's insertion of "cling" slips in the wrong word from a subsequent verse - it's a slip, not a deliberate alteration, and they lose the rhyme in transposing the verb), but Yang is clearly pointing out the oddity of the slip by having his characters comment on it.

As pointed out above, the contrast in the correct lyric is a natural one between "tonight" and "a bright summer day": "brighter summer day" doesn't make sense in this context (what summer day wouldn't be brighter than the middle of the night? - unless the songwriters were specifically excluding solar eclipses). It seems to me that this logical inconsistency is what the boys are specifically referring to: even with rudimentary English skills they can spot that the comparative is not comparing itself with anything.

Enough Elvis arcana already!

[Mise En Scene]

A Brighter Summer Day is screening at the UCLA Film & Television Archive at the Billy Wilder Theater on Friday October 19.

[GringoTex]

These were quite decent transfers of unrestored film elements. If these were the worst transfers you've seen you have had a remarkably sheltered cinematic existence.

Did you watch these on a high def set-up? Maybe tube viewing is acceptable. Worst artefacting I've ever seen on dvd. I literally couldn't finish a single one. Maybe I got a bad copy.

[Michael Kerpan]

Did you watch these on a high def set-up? Maybe tube viewing is acceptable. Worst artefacting I've ever seen on dvd. I literally couldn't finish a single one. Maybe I got a bad copy.

I watched these on my plain old television and (a bit) on my plain old computer monitor. I have seen many far worse DVDs -- including several of the first US versions of HHH DVDs.

[ltfontaine]

Maybe I got a bad copy.

Maybe you did, or maybe you are experiencing a player/software incompatibility problem. The source materials are rough in spots, but I don't recall a high level of artifacting.

[feihong]

Aiya. When I first said the set was gorgeous I was thinking primarily of the box in which the movies came, and the booklet. I can't read any of it, but it was really spectacular to see. When I show other people the box, people who don't have any concept of what Hou's work might be like, they are immediately interested--I think probably based on how interesting the box is. I've even had to pry it away from a few people who didn't want to let go of it.

The transfers of the films are not cool, not cool at all. Non-anamorphic, with low quality of detail, muffled soundtracks, and a lot of ghosting and such. Don't remember any macroblocking, but like others I've only watched the films on a tube TV and my iMac's computer monitor. Nonetheless, when better editions weren't forthcoming, I just got used to them. What else is there to do? As several people have pointed out, we aren't getting ANY Edward Yang DVDs at all, so the fact that Hou has any retrospective representation on DVD is kind of amazing.

I also agree about the American discs of Hou's work. If you want to see one of the worst DVDs you will EVER be able to see, try the r1 disc of THE PUPPETMASTER, and see if you can see anything left of the movie at all.

I'm planning to make it to the UCLA screening of BRIGHTER SUMMER STABBING OF CAUSELESS REBEL YOUTH ON GULING STREET. I figure I'll probably never see it again, except on crappy VCD. One of those "one chance" things.

[Cronenfly]

I know that this doesn't apply directly to Yang on DVD, but I wanted to make sure to post this somewhere: there's a retrospective of all of Yang's films (even Desires A.K.A. Expectations, Yang's section of the 4-part 1982 film In Our Time) at the Cinematheque Ontario this upcoming season. More info here, including a nice essay/intro to the retrospective by Andréa Picard. I missed the Rivette retro, but I will not miss this one.

[PimpPanda]

I viewed both Mahjong and A Brighter Summer Day at the cinematheque retrospective (was in Paris for most of the break so I could not the others). Even though it was a wonder to see ABSD on the big screen and in a decent print, the film still definitely needs a restoration job. There were even Chinese subtitles along with the English ones just like on the bootleg/VCD! Hopefully it'll get some sort of release as it's one of the greatest of all films but I doubt that it will anytime soon.

[ptmd]

There were even Mandarin (I believe) subtitles along with the English ones just like on the bootleg/VCD!

That just means it's a print that originated from a Taiwanese source, because, for a long time, almost all Taiwanese films that played in Taipei needed to be joint-subtitled in Mandarin and English so that they could appeal to as broad an audience as possible. This was even a government law for a while, as it was in Hong Kong, although that stopped around the time A Brighter Summer's Day came out. In any case, it is extremely unlikely that the film will receive a proper DVD release anytime soon, which is a real shame. This is a perfect choice for Criterion, who already released Yi Yi, but I don't think they're up to taking on something like this. Unlike Yi Yi, which played for 9 months in New York and was one of Wellspring's big hits, A Brighter Summer's Day has never even received a one-week commercial run anywhere in the US. That said, there's really no reason why a DVD of this couldn't do well, and it's certainly no more obscure/difficult than some of the other films Criterion's tackled in the last year (like Makavajev).

[Lemmy Caution]

Just to clarify a little.
There's no such thing as Mandarin sub-titles.
Mandarin is the main spoken dialect of mainland China. Subtitles would be just Chinese, using either simplified or traditional characters (essentially mainland and other respectively).

In China, Tv and movies are routinely sub-titled in Chinese, as many of the shows and much of the audience still use various dialects and/or heavily accented Mandarin.