Eclipse Discussion and Random Speculation

[movielocke]

I wonder if the mizoguchi set will be themed around Geisha or women? are there enough geisha films to fill out a set, of those films, I've only seen Sisters of Gion, but I know that many of his films were about the plight of women in general and geisha in particular.

a set called Mizoguchi's Geishas would probably sell better than one called 'early mizoguchi' or 'silent mizoguchi', but I imagine it comes off as more than a little crass to many collectors and serious cineastes.

[Michael Kerpan]

a set called Mizoguchi's Geishas would probably sell better than one called 'early mizoguchi' or 'silent mizoguchi', but I imagine it comes off as more than a little crass to many collectors and serious cineastes.

Mizoguchi geisha films besides Sister of Gion: Gion bayashi and Uwasa no onna. For a bonus, the digest version (all that remains) of the silent film, Tokyo March.

[Jean-Luc Garbo]

What about Oharu?

[fiddlesticks]

Oharu was not a geisha. She was a courtesan, or a lady-in-waiting, who was later reduced to prostitution.

[Michael Kerpan]

What about Oharu?

As noted by fiddlesticks, O-Haru was never a geisha. She WAS a prostitute for a period of time. So this could be squeezed into a Mizoguchi's Prostitutes box set -- but somehow I can't see Ecipse marketing something like this. Other prostitute films -- Oyuki the Virgin, Women of the Night, and Street of Shame.

[My Man Godfrey]

Suggested title: The Delirious Prostitute Flicks of Kenji Mizoguchi.

[miless]

one of the recent news items on the Criterion website is about the Berlin film fest:

Scorsese Opens Berlin Festival; Wajda and Leigh Competing
The 58th Berlin International Film Festival begins on February 7, and this year's lineup includes a handful of Criterion filmmakers. The opening-night selection is Martin Scorsese's Rolling Stones documentary Shine a Light, and Andrzej Wajda's World War II drama Katyn and Mike Leigh's latest character study, Happy-Go-Lucky, will be competing for the Golden Bear Award. Meanwhile, the Retrospective section will include a wide-ranging tribute to Luis Buñuel, with screenings of such hard-to-find films as Gran Casino, The Great Madcap, Daughter of Deceit, El bruto, Wuthering Heights, The Criminal Life of Archibaldo de la Cruz, Death in the Garden, and La fièvre monte à El Pao, as well as the better-known classics Los olvidados, The Exterminating Angel, The Milky Way, and That Obscure Object of Desire.

I wish that I could take this as evidence of an Eclipse "Mexican Buñuel box"... that would make my decade (as I've never been able to see many of these films), but, alas, it probably means nothing.

[Stefan Andersson]

Anybody want one or two Eclipse boxes devoted to Kon Ichikawa´s 26-part TV series GENJI MONOGATARI (1966), based on the famous 1 000-year old novel?
The movie version is out on an unsubbed Asian dvd (111 mins).

[What A Disgrace]

Eclipse or not...having finally drug up the stamina to watch Dog Star Man; and enjoying every remarkable second, I think I would like to see an Eclipse set comprising of select Stan Brakhage series. Do all of these films survive? Enough to make up a five or six disc set?

In any case, another Stan Brakhage set would be one killer release.

[miless]

Eclipse or not...having finally drug up the stamina to watch Dog Star Man; and enjoying every remarkable second, I think I would like to see an Eclipse set comprising of select Stan Brakhage series. Do all of these films survive? Enough to make up a five or six disc set?

In any case, another Stan Brakhage set would be one killer release.

I'm sure his wife has not destroyed them.
I have heard that Criterion would like to (or was planning to) put out a second release of Brakhage's films, but I bet the original didn't sell too well... making it difficult to justify another set (especially when the telecine process could be exceedingly difficult or expensive with his painted/collaged film works)

[backstreetsbackalright]

Eclipse or not...having finally drug up the stamina to watch Dog Star Man; and enjoying every remarkable second, I think I would like to see an Eclipse set comprising of select Stan Brakhage series. Do all of these films survive? Enough to make up a five or six disc set?

In any case, another Stan Brakhage set would be one killer release.

If nothing else, I understand that Brakhage had for some time made it a personal priority to see that the New York Public Library had prints of most of his work. Probably 16mm, but I dunno, were many of his films in 16 originally? That sort of info is out of my element, I'm afraid. Anyway, a terrific gentleman at the NYPL told me that they were getting double prints from Brakhage for like forever. One was made available for patrons to watch, the other was stored away for a rainy day. That's the way I understood it, anyway.

[Gregory]

The problem would not be that the films are unavailable. Marilyn Brakhage sells prints of them herself, and there would be enough remaining material for several box sets. As miless pointed out, the painstaking work required to transfer the films would not lend itself to an Eclipse release. I also would guess Marilyn Brakhage would not be keen on the idea of releasing another volume within a generically backaged, barebones, mid-price DVD line even if it made financial sense.
I would love another set, too (even a single-disc Vol.2) but I don't expect it anytime in the next few years at least. A Blu-Ray release would be wonderful, but I would expect that to come from Re:Voir before Criterion. Re:Voir has been talking about doing Blu-Ray releases almost as long as the format has existed but I think they're struggling with the additional production cost. Marilyn did say shortly after By Brakhage appeared that she would be willing to work with Criterion again but she has not mentioned anything about it since then, as far as I know.

Those of have watched By Brakhage and want to see more should of course watch Kino's Avant-Garde 2 set, but the best thing is to plan a trip somewhere where the films are being screened on film. I've only gotten to see one program like this, unfortunately, and I wish more museums and other institutions would screen his work. Many of them can be rented very cheaply from Canyon, so the cost shouldn't really be much of an obstacle.

And yes, most of his films are 16mm (some of which also exist in 35mm or even 8mm versions). He did a lot of work on super-8 and even IMAX with the intention of either reducing or enlarging it for release.

[colinr0380]

There is probably also the way that Criterion managed to deflect criticism through having their first Brakhage set approved by the man himself - there might be worries that without that approval the project would not stand a chance (didn't Fred Camper say he would never have done the first volume without Brakhage specifically asking him to?)

My own assumption is that it was a miracle the first volume came out and that now that HD is out the people behind the project who were churlish about releasing any of his work on a medium other than film but only did so on DVD because it seemed to be the pinnacle of the medium at the time (and were asked to by Brakhage) will probably not accept any more films coming out on anything less than the pinnacle format, and maybe not even then.

At the very least I do not think they would approve what they might consider "dumping" Brakhage films onto the Eclipse label, which has already said in their mission statement that they will not do any extra work in cleaning up their films.

It seems as if we are probably getting into that grey Carney/Cassavetes territory where without the guidance of the creator people make (or refuse to make) their own proprietorial decisions on what to do with the work. Especially when they do not really have any vested interest in doing so or seeming interest in broadening the audience for the work.

[Zazou dans le Metro]

From what you say, I'm wondering how Re:Voir got to release Brakhage on vhs??

[Gregory]

From what I've read I think Re:voir's position has been that VHS is superior to SD-DVD for experimental film in general because of the problem of compression with the latter, but they would be interested in releasing Blu-Ray discs as soon as they're no longer cost prohibitive. I think all of these formats are compromises when you consider the incredible subtlety and visual complexity of some of these films but I'm still very glad to live in a time when I there is so much to see and it is so affordable. Unseen Cinema, By Brakhage and the like are really unbelievable bargains.
(edited to fix garbled syntax)

[Adam]

Gregory is on the mark. That's exactly teh view of Pip Chodorov, who runs Re:voir. The Academy Film Archive (namely Mark Toscano) is in the process of preserving/restoring all of Brakhage's films. So Criterion/Eclipse wouldn't have to do any restoration work, just proper telecines of the best elements.

[Zazou dans le Metro]

I was enquiring more from the point of view of Brakhage's acceptance (and consequently now the estate's perspective) more than the philosophy of the publishing house. In other words if it forseen that further releases are hampered by the estate's unwillingness to use the dvd medium what secured approval for a vhs release?
Are you saying Brakhage bought into this philosophy too and OK'd the release?

[Gregory]

I thought that's what you might have meant, and I'm afraid I can't provide a satisfactory answer about Stan Brakhage's views on the pros and cons of VHS vs. DVD. However, I believe Stan and Marilyn Brakhage never had a problem with the VHS releases. It's important to remember that releases of Brakhage on video go back before Criterion or Re:Voir, and I think Brakhage and pretty much anyone else involved has treated them as references (to introduce people to some of the fundamentals of Brakhage's work, including for study and classroom use) rather than real cinematic experience of the films.
And, again, I don't know of any reason to think that the absence of more Brakhage from Criterion has anything to do with Marilyn Brakhage or Camper's views about DVD. Camper was leery of video formats in general long before the Criterion project materialized, but he lent his services as critic and technical advisor just the same, and on his site he says (making a long story short here) that the digital transfers looked better in comparison to the films than he had expected.
It seems clear that the label was dabbling or experimenting with this kind of project rather than embarking on anything resembling a longterm commitment to it. The tastes and interests of the people guiding the company figure in, but perhaps more importantly the difficulty and profitability issues in something like this. Kline wrote to Camper that it was the hardest transfer job Criterion had ever done. I could speculate on how much work Kino put into their own "Brakhage" release but I definitely don't want to start another Kino debate. They did not have to worry about getting the color just right, as Criterion did, not did they have to contend with something like "Moth Light." It's to the label's credit that they didn't completely wash their hands of this kind of thing after it was released, apparently, as there seem to have been discussions of a follow-up. We just have to keep hoping for similar projects in the future (with the expectation that it may never happen) and finding ways other than DVD to get the occasional fix.

[MuzikJunky]

How ’bout an Eclipse boxed set of some Nigerian videos by Chico Ejiro? Has anyone here actually seen any of Nollywood’s prolific output and read anything besides the articles from 2002 that were in the NY Times and in Time magazine? I mean, this guy directed a whopping 80 films in a 5-year period. Bring on the kente cloth and the hardcore sistas from around-the-way! Peace.

[portnoy]

MuzikJunky just became my favorite board gimmick.

[Cinephrenic]

mean, this guy directed a whopping 80 films in a 5-year period

Are those just his masterpieces?
I know some guys whose filmed more within 5 years, but they all in the porn business...eventually, waiting for Eclipse to notice.

[gubbelsj]

They don't call Chico Ejiro "Mr. Prolific" for nothing. Here's the trailer for one of his hundreds of films - Outkast. And check out the other trailers available just to the left of the player.

[fdm]

They don't call Chico Ejiro "Mr. Prolific" for nothing. Here's the trailer for one of his hundreds of films - Outkast. And check out the other trailers available just to the left of the player.

Marvelous. Eclipse can start offering season sets.

[MuzikJunky]

They don't call Chico Ejiro Mr. Prolific for nothing. Here's the trailer for one of his hundreds of films - Outkast. And check out the other trailers available just to the left of the player.

There are movies by other Nigerian video filmmakers there, not just Mr. Prolific. Peace.

[domino harvey]

If we see anything from the Dark Continent, it will be Yeelen-- who owns that anyways?