Criterion Blu-ray

[KeystoneCop]

What makes me really excited about 1080p (and its now-adoptive vessel, Blu-Ray) is that projection-based home theater set-ups are suddenly a viable option.

Now I know that people have been enjoying DVD-based projector set-ups probably since their inception, but as someone who has experienced that avenue, I must admit that I'd always felt an impasse there. Once you blow up an MPEG-2-encoded DVD to 100+ inches, the limitations of DVDs become annoyingly apparent (blockiness, softness, dullness, not to mention that EE becomes disgusting at that scale). To me, DVDs will always be paired to the 20" to 60" (at the very high end) home entertainment era.

And they're fine and good for that. But the idea of seeing something like "Contempt" projected onto a large screen in an HD master from Criterion feels like nothing less than the fruition of some kind of long-awaited cinephilic dream of being able to "see movies how they're supposed to be seen" cozily at home. I certainly know that technology will continue to advance, and that people felt similar anticipation for the possibilities of DVD when that format was taking off, but there's no doubt that we're approaching some ideal for film-to-home transfer with this new incarnation -- the next leap in technology might overstep 35mm film, or at the very least surpass what a regular person would ever be able to put together in their home in order to experience that (can't really see your average, middle-class house ever containing anything greater than a 160" screen or so at the very high end, right? I mean, it's just not physically practical).

I certainly don't have the money to put together a good projection-based home theater room, and probably won't for a while, but it's getting so much more affordable that the idea is really becoming exciting.

[fdm]

If one looks at it this way then it's conceivable that Criterion is TRYING to exit the SD market within 24-36 months. Because if they are priced the same, that Borders shopping mom would go for the BluRay. Of course I'm assuming alot in this scenario (starting with the assumption that Criterion WON'T lower the MSRP on SD). I'll bet they do lower the SD MSRP first quarter 2009 and all my rage will be misplaced. It just makes too much sense to do so.

Don't plan on it. At least their BR pricing will be reasonable (I certainly thought it would be otherwise). They likely will sell just as many DVDs+BRs on any given title as they do just DVDs now (maybe a few more, maybe less with our lovely economy). And it still costs the same to put the packages together. Net result: DVDs will be around for a long time, and Criterion is not all that likely to cut their pricing on them.

[subliminac]

I'm surprised nobody has commented on this news yet.

Which begs the question, what can we expect from these little boutique labels on bluray who have a reputation for poorly produced sd disks?

[Tribe]

I'm surprised nobody has commented on this news yet.

Which begs the question, what can we expect from these little boutique labels on bluray who have a reputation for poorly produced sd disks?

Huh?

[Petty Bourgeoisie]

If one looks at it this way then it's conceivable that Criterion is TRYING to exit the SD market within 24-36 months. Because if they are priced the same, that Borders shopping mom would go for the BluRay. Of course I'm assuming alot in this scenario (starting with the assumption that Criterion WON'T lower the MSRP on SD). I'll bet they do lower the SD MSRP first quarter 2009 and all my rage will be misplaced. It just makes too much sense to do so.

Don't plan on it. At least their BR pricing will be reasonable (I certainly thought it would be otherwise). They likely will sell just as many DVDs+BRs on any given title as they do just DVDs now (maybe a few more, maybe less with our lovely economy). And it still costs the same to put the packages together. Net result: DVDs will be around for a long time, and Criterion is not all that likely to cut their pricing on them.

I must respectfully disagree. I think we are seeing the first salvo of a corporate war against SD. I believe we will see an all out assault during the next 12-24 months to make BluRay the standard. I still remember the day that DVD's overtook VHS for market share. It was on all the major news broadcasts and was hailed as a big deal. It WAS a big deal because it meant big money for the entertainment industry. How many times have we heard "The money is made in DVD's, not the box office". Well within 36 months we will see headlines again when BluRay takes 50% plus 1 market share and $175 BluRay players will be flying off shelves. The money to be made on getting consumers to upgrade their home entertainment equipment is ripe to be picked. And believe me it will get picked thoroughly. Now I do agree that SD is going nowhere but it will soon be the province of documentaries, small independent firms and the like. To get a flagship label like Criterion to jump onto the BluRay bandwagon signals the big boys have decided BluRay will soon have market share. We've lived this story before. Why can't we see history repeating itself? I feel like I'm hijacking this thread so I'll stop now.

[cgray]

I'm surprised nobody has commented on this news yet.

Which begs the question, what can we expect from these little boutique labels on bluray who have a reputation for poorly produced sd disks?

Huh?

Kino is releasing Fallen Angels on blu. I think Sublimac's question is, "Should we be excited, since Kino's SD releases normally suck?"

[domino harvey]

Can you imagine an interlaced Blu-ray lol

[malcolm1980]

The idea of seeing Walkabout, Chungking Express and The Last Emperor on Blu-Ray makes me all excited like a little girl.

[El Manchego]

It is capitalism 101 that if a product is "inferior" within the product lineup, then the company can no longer charge top dollar for it.

Economically speaking, that is inaccurate.

I guess it is inaccurate when it comes to poorly managed companies. Can you imagine Jeep charging more for the budget Patriot model than for the fully loaded Commander? People would walk off the lot shaking their heads. I can imagine many people shopping at Borders in early 2009 and they pick up a Criterion dvd title in BR and SD and look at the prices. They'll notice the price is the same and they'll think "Well, that's odd. The folks at criterion forum say BR is jaw-dropping and SD just doesn't cut it anymore. So why do I have to pay just as much for the SD?" Maybe a simplistic scenario but you get my drift.

As Morbii alluded to, this isn't the same thing. Besides, if the demand for a Patriot were far higher than the Commander, despite the higher quality, Jeep could charge a higher price, which is essentially what Criterion is doing by pricing SD discs at an equal rate. Once the demand for BR discs increases significantly, I can assure you within a short period of time there will be an alteration in Criterion's pricing structure to reflect the lower demand for SD discs. Additionally, there are associated costs due to a Blu-ray player being a tied good that is necessary to have in order to use the BR discs themselves (as Morbii said), which would be considered an additional cost to consumers that would factor into their purchasing decision (which has kept many of us from supporting BR up until this point). As evidenced by several in this thread, and BR player sales in general, this is a cost the vast majority of home video consumers face. And since when did maximizing profit become poor management? Although it may seem absurd from a consumers perspective for an inferior product to be priced relatively close to its superior, if as a company you could continue to charge a higher price for the inferior product without adversely affecting your quantity demanded, why wouldn't you? This is particularly true when a firm has market power (ability to influence price in the market), which Criterion I would say almost certainly does given their mission statement. This will be the case until BR discs reach a certain level of market saturation. Capitalism 101: the market runs the show, and based on what the market gives you, make sure you maximize your profit.

[Darth Lavender]

Can you imagine an interlaced Blu-ray lol

Actually, that's nothing new...

"Alice Cooper Live at Montreux" (and probably a lot of "shot on digital video" concert films) is interlaced...

As are the deleted scenes on '300' (can't remember if they're interlaced 1080 or NTSC)

[fdm]

I'm surprised nobody has commented on this news yet.

Which begs the question, what can we expect from these little boutique labels on bluray who have a reputation for poorly produced sd disks?

Actually the Lola Montes news is rather intriguing too...

But yeah, Kino, phew... boggles the mind...

Can Facets be far behind... :-#

[domino harvey]

A Facets Blu-ray disc is just a vcd file burned to a CD-R

[denti alligator]

Shit, I go away for a couple days and this happens!!

We need more info and the last few pages of this thread contain lots that I hope some of us will send to Mulvaney to be answered.

I'm thrilled, of course. Don't know exactly what to do with my unwatched re-issue of the Third Man. (sorry, kevpip)

[Morbii]

Don't know exactly what to do with my unwatched re-issue of the Third Man. (sorry, kevpip)

LOL

And david, seriously, buy a PS3. Amazing player, even if you only purchase it for BD playback (arguably the best player out there).

[mpippia]

One of the members of the blu-ray.com forum posted the following:-

Got an e-mail from Criterion yesterday where they said that Passolini's masterpiece Salo is comming to Blu-ray later this year as well.

Message was posted on Page 4 of that thread.

[HerrSchreck]

One of the members of the blu-ray.com forum posted the following:-

Got an e-mail from Criterion yesterday where they said that Passolini's masterpiece Salo is comming to Blu-ray later this year as well.

Message was posted on Page 4 of that thread.

...and verily, from within yon hi-deffanboydom came ye joyful noise, compassing round about the unbelievers: "Hi Def Poopy! YESSSSSS"!

EDIT:

Don't know exactly what to do with my unwatched re-issue of the Third Man. (sorry, kevpip)

That's true--3 editions of the same film (four if you count essential arthouse's de-extra'd version) in a 7 year stretch. That's very Universal Monsters Classics-esque.

[editman]

Regarding The Digital Bits' comment on the CC blu-ray plans:

they're still working out whether or not their new Blu-ray releases will use a new numbering system of their own (different from the DVD versions).

I must say, and I hope people who count are reading this, that perhaps going blu is a good time to re-think about the practicality of the numbering system, or even completely abandon it.

As much as it has become an integral part of CC's practice since the laserdisc years, the numbering system as an incentive for collectors to complete the set is becoming rather impractical, once the amount of titles available reaches over 200.

How many people out there would actually buy the entire set based on the number itself? In most cases, people would purchase certain titles they're interested in. Occasionally they'll blind buy a title because CC puts it out. But I reckon very few would compulsively blind-buy based on the spine numbers.

And it's not like the titles are being released in the order of the spine numbers.

Nor the number is given based on the significance of a title in the history of cinema. (Hopefully not!)

It's not like the spine number actually helps to categorize a title. (I mean, how many of you would be more familiar with the laserdisc spine #127, or DVD spine #036 - or blu-ray #13??? - than the film title itself?)

So what's the point of having a spine number? To remind us that we all have to start all over again?

[tavernier]

It's just a Criterion conceit--like the wacky "C." (But they did go and change the "C," so there's a precedent.)

[rwaits]

Yeah, at this stage in the game I wouldn't mind if Criterion dropped the numbering system altogether.

[davebert]

I would prefer little slices of an image on the spine so that if you get the last 12-20 releases together on a shelf it makes some beautiful panorama shot.

Or something even crazier that will drive collectors nuts.

[JHunter]

Yeah, at this stage in the game I wouldn't mind if Criterion dropped the numbering system altogether.

I'd prefer just continuing the number system on the Blu-rays so that the DVDs and Blu-rays are the same.

[SimonI]

I quite like the spine numbers for no real reason; I think the deal breaker here would be if they used the new size cases for the BDs, because then they wouldn't fit very well visually with the SD stuff and so there'd be no logical reason to put them on the same shelf.

[Gigi M.]

I quite like the spine numbers for no real reason; I think the deal breaker here would be if they used the new size cases for the BDs, because then they wouldn't fit very well visually with the SD stuff and so there'd be no logical reason to put them on the same shelf.

I'll bet they use:

A) the same style packing as the Planet Earth Blu Ray edition: normal Blu Ray case inside a slip cover + the booklet inside the slip cover

B) Close Encounters Blu Ray edition: digipak inside slip cover

Their booklets won't fit inside a Blu case.

Edit: I'm surprise no one hasn't brought up if MoC would go Blu also.

[Darth Lavender]

But yeah, Kino, phew... boggles the mind...

Can Facets be far behind

Actually, Kino has been getting better of late... Their 'Nosferatu' easily compares with one of MoC's best efforts, and Battleship Potemkin looks to be a pretty good release, too (admittedly, I haven't gotten around to buying either yet)

I'm sure I'll want to read reviews first, but I think Kino blurays could excellent (assuming they follow Criterion's lead with the pricing, instead of the Bandai Visual approach). They seem the most likely company to finally offer a silent movie on High Definition. And, besides, Tartan UK has a similarly atrocious reputation (lots of NTSC>PAL conversions, etc.) but, judging from the reviews, they seem to have done ok on The Seventh Seal and the a lesser extent Oldboy (apparently that one is a tad soft; perhaps the way the movie should look. But, with that release, Tartan did offer the first 7.1 Bluray)

[codam]

I'm surprise no one hasn't brought up if MoC would go Blu also.

It seems as though Mad Detective is going to be MoC's first Blu-Ray release.