112 Playtime
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Perkins Cobb
- Joined: Tue Apr 29, 2008 4:49 pm
Re: 112 Playtime
I disagree. Hulot's "romance" with the tourist played by Barbara Dennek provides just the right amount of temporal structure for the film's set pieces. And I think you actually feel the day-night-day chronology pretty acutely; one reason I love Playtime (and La Notte, too) is that for me it approximates the actual feeling of being up all night in some kind of social setting, or series of them.
I'm not sure I see much substance in Jost's comments beyond the subjective handicap of just not finding Tati funny. But I'm glad Jost has a blog, nonetheless.
I'm not sure I see much substance in Jost's comments beyond the subjective handicap of just not finding Tati funny. But I'm glad Jost has a blog, nonetheless.
- Murdoch
- Joined: Mon Apr 21, 2008 3:59 am
- Location: Upstate NY
Re: 112 Playtime
I love La Notte, too.I disagree. Hulot's "romance" with the tourist played by Barbara Dennek provides just the right amount of temporal structure for the film's set pieces. And I think you actually feel the day-night-day chronology pretty acutely; one reason I love Playtime (and La Notte, too) is that for me it approximates the actual feeling of being up all night in some kind of social setting, or series of them.
Can't say I see any substance in what Jost is saying, his criticisms seem more a reaction to the critical praise the film has garnered than the film itself. The very things he criticizes about the film are the aspects of it that I see as most praise-worthy, such as the cubicle and apartment visuals. Despite Jost's assertions that the film is undeserving of its critical stature, his criticisms are rather base and equate simply to "I didn't think it was funny."
- Jun-Dai
- 監督
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Re: 112 Playtime
At least Jost is clear that he is only presenting his "view" on the film—i.e., not implying that we are wrong for liking or getting the film.
In my "view", the film's sense of timing and pacing is exquisite. The film is like music. The visual elements and gags in the film have a rhythm, one that increases and decreases in tempo, crescendoes, descrescendoes, refers back to earlier sections, and has a magnificent tutti carousel scene at the end.
I think in Playtime Tati finally let go of all but the lightest touch of a narrative framework, and managed to take himself into something of a different art form, one that you only ever see in much smaller films, e.g., with something like Ballet Mécanique. Clearly his audience (and Jost) was not ready to go there with him, and I think that is what the failure of Playtime is about more than Tati's inability to accomplish what he was trying to accomplish. People were expecting something different—they wanted a bigger and better version of Mon Oncle with all those things that made it charming. Instead they got certain aspects of Mon Oncle—ones they weren't looking for—distilled into a much more pure form without all the charming distractions. What's more, by making a film about the loss of charm in modern society (so that it can be found only in the nooks and crevices and occasional streetcorner flower shops), Tati necessarily had to leave out most of the things that made his other films lovable—the sweeper who never manages to sweep anything, the rooftop apartment. It's impossible to be charmed by Playtime in the way that one is charmed by its predecessors, and it's that charm that people loved so much in his earlier films.
It seems also like Jost was looking for the film to be a visual comedy, which it is, but which it does not excel at as much as Mon Oncle. But to look for the humor in the film is to see the trees but miss the forest. The jokes in the film are the strains and motifs in the service of a larger composition. Perhaps the film would have been better had the jokes been as good as the better jokes in Mon Oncle, but Playtime has by far the superior orchestration and structure, and is the only film I've ever seen that even tries such an approach on a large scale. It may not be the Beethoven's ninth of cinema, but it's the only film that tried—the rest have all been aiming for Shakespeare.
On a separate note, Playtime also has points to make about the dehumanization of modern society (everything looks like an airport), loss of culture (city posters all look the same, Paris landmarks only visible in reflections), and the modern trends towards voyeurism (floor-to-ceiling windows make an apartment building look like a TV). In this regard, Playtime is not so different from other films (e.g., Peeping Tom), but it is I think more detailed, nuanced, and focused than most. It is also the continuation of (or logical conclusion of) Mr. Hulot's Holiday and Mon Oncle, although in that light Playtime is a pretty bleak and depressing place to wind up that particular train of thought.
In my "view", the film's sense of timing and pacing is exquisite. The film is like music. The visual elements and gags in the film have a rhythm, one that increases and decreases in tempo, crescendoes, descrescendoes, refers back to earlier sections, and has a magnificent tutti carousel scene at the end.
I think in Playtime Tati finally let go of all but the lightest touch of a narrative framework, and managed to take himself into something of a different art form, one that you only ever see in much smaller films, e.g., with something like Ballet Mécanique. Clearly his audience (and Jost) was not ready to go there with him, and I think that is what the failure of Playtime is about more than Tati's inability to accomplish what he was trying to accomplish. People were expecting something different—they wanted a bigger and better version of Mon Oncle with all those things that made it charming. Instead they got certain aspects of Mon Oncle—ones they weren't looking for—distilled into a much more pure form without all the charming distractions. What's more, by making a film about the loss of charm in modern society (so that it can be found only in the nooks and crevices and occasional streetcorner flower shops), Tati necessarily had to leave out most of the things that made his other films lovable—the sweeper who never manages to sweep anything, the rooftop apartment. It's impossible to be charmed by Playtime in the way that one is charmed by its predecessors, and it's that charm that people loved so much in his earlier films.
It seems also like Jost was looking for the film to be a visual comedy, which it is, but which it does not excel at as much as Mon Oncle. But to look for the humor in the film is to see the trees but miss the forest. The jokes in the film are the strains and motifs in the service of a larger composition. Perhaps the film would have been better had the jokes been as good as the better jokes in Mon Oncle, but Playtime has by far the superior orchestration and structure, and is the only film I've ever seen that even tries such an approach on a large scale. It may not be the Beethoven's ninth of cinema, but it's the only film that tried—the rest have all been aiming for Shakespeare.
On a separate note, Playtime also has points to make about the dehumanization of modern society (everything looks like an airport), loss of culture (city posters all look the same, Paris landmarks only visible in reflections), and the modern trends towards voyeurism (floor-to-ceiling windows make an apartment building look like a TV). In this regard, Playtime is not so different from other films (e.g., Peeping Tom), but it is I think more detailed, nuanced, and focused than most. It is also the continuation of (or logical conclusion of) Mr. Hulot's Holiday and Mon Oncle, although in that light Playtime is a pretty bleak and depressing place to wind up that particular train of thought.
- Matango
- Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2005 5:19 am
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Re: 112 Playtime
I would have thought that Trafic is the logical conclusion, no?
- Jun-Dai
- 監督
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Re: 112 Playtime
If it is, I don't really see it. I mean, Trafic definitely has its similarities with Playtime (the auto show, etc.), and its similarities with the rest of the Hulot films, but it really steps back from Playtime's conclusion of the series—a restoration of Frenchness, charm, countryside, etc. Rather than a sequel to Playtime it seems like a different sort of resolution to Mr. Hulot's Holiday and Mon Oncle—one that is much milder and much less bleak, but also one that follows a less clear progression. Playtime almost loses its story to the setting and to its rhythmic/musical elements. Trafic, on the other hand, is the most story-driven and character-driven of the four films, and the humor is largely subordinate to that story.Matango wrote:I would have thought that Trafic is the logical conclusion, no?
I have to imagine that if Tati had made Trafic instead of Playtime, while people might have been disappointed with the production values, they would have appreciated the enduring charm of Mr. Hulot finding his place in an increasingly alien world.
In Playtime Mr. Hulot has no place at all, and what I think most people probably felt was missing from Playtime was exactly what Tati was illustrating the destruction of in Playtime. Decades later it's much easier to see the arc between the three films, and to me that arc seems so much stronger than any statements the films are making individually. Tati is sucking all the life out of Mr. Hulot's world, leaving him only reflections and a much-photographed flower shop to find something familiar. This world is so inhuman that eventually its inhabitants momentarily tear it apart in a restaurant rebellion. This is strong enough, but as an extension of the futuristic house in Mon Oncle, we can see this transformation in stages. Trafic, on the other hand, doesn't really fit into this arc at all.
- Gregory
- Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 8:07 pm
Re: 112 Playtime
I see him implying that all over the place. He doesn't just say that he didn't find the jokes funny; he says thatJun-Dai wrote:At least Jost is clear that he is only presenting his "view" on the film—i.e., not implying that we are wrong for liking or getting the film.
the spectator is tiresomely bludgeoned with increasingly more frantic, repetitious and less funny humor.
That's not exactly speaking for himself. His argument is not just that the jokes did not fit with his own sense of humor; it's that the jokes are bad because they're supposedly so repetitive. What he fails to acknowledge is that the repetition of running gags works wonderfully in this type of film (and in Keaton, Chaplin, etc.) in a way that telling the same punchline in a film based on verbal humor would not.
He also assumes wrongly that the defining purpose of the film was to be funny, whereas I find that the humor is part of a film that, in a deceptively lighthearted way, portrays isolation and frustration, and much more else than I could summarize, and it does this in an extremely beautiful way. Even if I didn't find the film funny in the least, I'd still love it.
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patricio00
- Joined: Sun Jun 14, 2009 1:58 am
- Foam
- Joined: Sat Apr 04, 2009 4:47 am
Re: 112 Playtime
Can you imagine how much less funny M. Hulot's Holiday would be without the constantly squeaking door?the spectator is tiresomely bludgeoned with increasingly more frantic, repetitious and less funny humor.
- cdnchris
- Site Admin
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- tubal
- Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 12:52 pm
- Location: Zürich, Switzerland
- zedz
- Joined: Sun Nov 07, 2004 11:24 pm
Re: 112 Playtime
Looks very nice. However, maybe it's just my failing eyesight, but does anybody else see edge enhancement in the BluRay caps? Specifically the first cap (look at the guy with his back to us under the 'O') and the third one (Hulot and umbrella in the glass room). I suppose this is an occupational hazard with so much grey-on-grey.tubal wrote:DVD Beaver on the blu-ray vs. DVD
- daniel p
- Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:01 am
- Location: Melbourne, Australia
Re: 112 Playtime
I see the halo's also.
I am a bit disappointed really, and was expecting this to be AMAZING being 65mm and all, it is a shame they used the 35mm imo.
I am a bit disappointed really, and was expecting this to be AMAZING being 65mm and all, it is a shame they used the 35mm imo.
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Bleddyn Williams
- Joined: Fri Mar 17, 2006 6:33 pm
- Location: Billerica MA USA
Re: 112 Playtime
I just bought this in the Barnes & Noble 50% off sale. Comparing it with the 2-disc DVD its obviously better, but I was surprised to see EE present. This is the first Criterion blu-ray I've bought that I've been disappointed with.daniel p wrote:I see the halo's also.
I am a bit disappointed really, and was expecting this to be AMAZING being 65mm and all, it is a shame they used the 35mm imo.
- Particle Zoo
- Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 4:01 pm
- Location: South of England
Re: 112 Playtime
I'm genuinly surprised that there appears to be a feeling of disapointment with this Blu ray transfer. I watched it through my projector and was nearly dancing with joy. I honestly don't think screen captures serve Blu Ray well. Often it's the image in motion which really demonstrates the mediums' sometimes subtle superiority. No compressed image in home viewing format is going to be perfect, but frankly, unless you live in a mansion with the ability to project a truly gigantic picture, (and if you did, you could probably afford a 35mm projector and prints anyway), I really don't see how Playtime could look any better. And as for taking the transfer from 70mm rather than the 35mm print, given current equipment and TVs or Projectors, I doubt we would see a difference.
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Bleddyn Williams
- Joined: Fri Mar 17, 2006 6:33 pm
- Location: Billerica MA USA
Re: 112 Playtime
I did check this in motion - and noticed the edge enhancement very quickly. I agree its the best version I've seen, but just wish that the EE hadn't been applied.Particle Zoo wrote:I'm genuinly surprised that there appears to be a feeling of disapointment with this Blu ray transfer. I watched it through my projector and was nearly dancing with joy. I honestly don't think screen captures serve Blu Ray well. Often it's the image in motion which really demonstrates the mediums' sometimes subtle superiority. No compressed image in home viewing format is going to be perfect, but frankly, unless you live in a mansion with the ability to project a truly gigantic picture, (and if you did, you could probably afford a 35mm projector and prints anyway), I really don't see how Playtime could look any better. And as for taking the transfer from 70mm rather than the 35mm print, given current equipment and TVs or Projectors, I doubt we would see a difference.
- Murdoch
- Joined: Mon Apr 21, 2008 3:59 am
- Location: Upstate NY
Re: 112 Playtime
Anybody catch the Breathless reference at about 59:45? I was just rewatching the film and got a kick out of seeing it in there - mostly because I never noticed it before.
Always something new to see with Tati's cinema. *delighted sigh*
Always something new to see with Tati's cinema. *delighted sigh*
- bugsy_pal
- Joined: Mon May 12, 2008 5:28 am
Re: 112 Playtime
I saw the restored 65mm or 70mm print a few years ago here in Australia. It was the first time I'd seen the film and I was absolutely blown away by it. It looked beautiful, and was unlike any cinema experience I had ever had. I had lots of chuckles at the gentle humour, but I really cracked up at the scene where Hulot breaks the glass door and the doorman is still holding the handle.
I bought a region 4 DVD of the film, which was good but not great - the colour had that greenish hue that seems to be the case with a number of the DVD editions. I have now obtained the Criterion Blu-Ray and will just have to await getting a region-free modification for it so that I can view this lovely film in the best possible quality.
I bought a region 4 DVD of the film, which was good but not great - the colour had that greenish hue that seems to be the case with a number of the DVD editions. I have now obtained the Criterion Blu-Ray and will just have to await getting a region-free modification for it so that I can view this lovely film in the best possible quality.
- dad1153
- Joined: Thu Apr 16, 2009 2:32 pm
- Location: New York, NY
Re: 112 Playtime
Watched "Playtime" on Blu-ray over the weekend for the first time (47" 1080p LCD from four feet away), then a second time and a third time with Philip Kemp's video notes (with a noticeably degraded PQ). Having just become a fan of Tati's and his Monsieur Hulot character it's both exhilarating and depressing to see "Playtime" both succeed and fail in its spectacular ambitions. While the production and set design of 'Tativille' are staggering in their pre-CGI attempts at recreating a functioning city (the equivalent of a 'cast of thousands' epic in scope) they don't always work (the cardboard cutouts are way too obvious). When the set/art design achieves technical perfection it drowns-out the humanity and charm of Hulot's bumbling antics and of anyone human doing anything, comedic or otherwise, in front and/or around them. While this is deliberate (Tati wanted to diminish Hulot's presence and importance to "Playtime's" look-for-your-own-joke-in-this-widescreen-picture technique) the results to me lack the heart and soul that made "Mon Oncle" and "M. Hulot's Holiday" classics (Hulot's attempt to give a gift to the young American girl he befriends poorly attempts to emulate similar scenes in the earlier Hulot movies). That said the Royal Garden opening night sequence is a slapstick tour-de-force that could have degenerated into chaos or mean-spirited cheap shots (like in Blake Edwards' obvious ripoff "The Party") but doesn't because of the steady hand of Tati choreographing this chaos to maximum cinematic effect. Like most ahead-of-their-time productions "Playtime's" many separate set pieces (the posters of other cities, the 'gliding' lady, the traffic carousel, the reflections of Parisian monuments on glass, etc.) are more impressive than the sum total of their parts. Criterion's bounty of bonus features (particularly Tati's audio recording at the movie's American premiere in San Francisco in 1972) help put the film, its creator and the effort that went into making it in its proper perspective. I admire "Playtime" on a filmmaking level but it left me cold as a Tati movie the first two tries. I can't help but put it below "Mon Oncle" and a little ahead of "M. Hulot's Holiday."
The high-def transfer is really good (except for the opening credits which look rough) but it's not as spectacular as it could have been since it comes from a '35mm reduction negative struck from a restored 65mm interpositive' (straight quote from the insert). Basically we're at least two generations removed from the original 70mm negative so the HD quality, while good, lacks the fidelity and sharp focus we've come to expect from similar titles like "2001: A Space Odyssey" that were given a thorough and complete restoration. Since "Playtime" was a financial disaster and lots of footage/deleted scenes are MIA there just weren't enough resources and material to make this HD transfer as good as it could have been (i.e. the cost of striking an HD master from the 70mm negative or something higher than a 35mm reduction negative wasn't worth the expense because of the limited number of copies they expect to sell). I will see "Playtime" again on BD a few times and on a 70mm projection if it ever comes back to NYC but so far this feels more like an ambitious misfire than the Tati movie I wanted to see build on the building blocks of its predecessors. "Trafic" is next.
The high-def transfer is really good (except for the opening credits which look rough) but it's not as spectacular as it could have been since it comes from a '35mm reduction negative struck from a restored 65mm interpositive' (straight quote from the insert). Basically we're at least two generations removed from the original 70mm negative so the HD quality, while good, lacks the fidelity and sharp focus we've come to expect from similar titles like "2001: A Space Odyssey" that were given a thorough and complete restoration. Since "Playtime" was a financial disaster and lots of footage/deleted scenes are MIA there just weren't enough resources and material to make this HD transfer as good as it could have been (i.e. the cost of striking an HD master from the 70mm negative or something higher than a 35mm reduction negative wasn't worth the expense because of the limited number of copies they expect to sell). I will see "Playtime" again on BD a few times and on a 70mm projection if it ever comes back to NYC but so far this feels more like an ambitious misfire than the Tati movie I wanted to see build on the building blocks of its predecessors. "Trafic" is next.
Last edited by dad1153 on Wed Jun 02, 2010 1:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
- Magic Hate Ball
- Joined: Mon Jul 09, 2007 10:15 pm
- Location: Seattle, WA
Re: 112 Playtime
I think it's the dehumanization that draws me to Playtime. Tati's films progressed from small and human (Jour de fête) to the unwieldy and cold (Playtime), and then the unbelievably cynical Trafic, where an almost post-apocalyptic tone prevails; play time is over. Though I've heard people describe Trafic as uplifting and pleasant, so maybe I'm in the wrong, but seeing as Tati's planned next step was to kill Hulot off it seems like this misanthropic trend wasn't an accident. Tati's failing to deliver the handkerchief to the young lady at the end of Playtime seems almost light in comparison to the ending of Trafic. Playtime is a mean film, but it retains a glimmer of hope; the Tati in Playtime can always go back to the vacation hotel, the Tati in Trafic is lost forever. It's understandable, though, that the dark clouds of Tativille would put you off.
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patricio00
- Joined: Sun Jun 14, 2009 1:58 am
Re: 112 Playtime
I have just the opposite reaction to Playtime. To me the film says ok, cold modernism is a fact of life, here to stay, but there are all these tiny precious moments everywhere, shared moments between people, that help us endure over it all. The restaurant scene, to me is not a mean scene at all.
- dad1153
- Joined: Thu Apr 16, 2009 2:32 pm
- Location: New York, NY
Re: 112 Playtime
^^^ I didn't say the restaurant scene was mean. Read again what I wrote: ... the Royal Garden opening night sequence is a slapstick tour-de-force that could have degenerated into chaos or mean-spirited cheap shots (like in Blake Edwards' obvious ripoff "The Party") but doesn't because of the steady hand of Tati choreographing this chaos to maximum cinematic effect.
- aox
- Joined: Fri Jun 20, 2008 4:02 pm
- Location: nYc
Re: 112 Playtime
Wow, couldn't disagree more. I still don't notice them and I have seen this 10 times (once in 65mm projection in a theater).dad1153 wrote:they don't always work (the cardboard cutouts are way too obvious).
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patricio00
- Joined: Sun Jun 14, 2009 1:58 am
Re: 112 Playtime
dad1153 I was commenting on Magic Hate Ball's comment above mine: "Playtime is a mean film". Sorry for the confusion.
- dad1153
- Joined: Thu Apr 16, 2009 2:32 pm
- Location: New York, NY
Re: 112 Playtime
^^^ Ooops, lo siento mucho. Disculpeme! :-"
aox, I noticed the cardboard cutouts right away at the airport (specifically at the departure gate, when two cardboard cutouts in the upper-level back are clearly being moved around to simulate body movement of two people talking). I was ready to buy these cardboards as a cute metaphor for people being taken for granted or as a source of comedy. But the bonus features make it clear that Tati and the production crew put them there to try and fool the audience into thinking there were more extras on the set than there actually were. Well, they failed (and spectacularly at that) but I still admire them for at least trying to put stuff in front of the camera instead of sitting on their rear-ends saying 'we'll wait for computers to get better and can do this job for us.'
aox, I noticed the cardboard cutouts right away at the airport (specifically at the departure gate, when two cardboard cutouts in the upper-level back are clearly being moved around to simulate body movement of two people talking). I was ready to buy these cardboards as a cute metaphor for people being taken for granted or as a source of comedy. But the bonus features make it clear that Tati and the production crew put them there to try and fool the audience into thinking there were more extras on the set than there actually were. Well, they failed (and spectacularly at that) but I still admire them for at least trying to put stuff in front of the camera instead of sitting on their rear-ends saying 'we'll wait for computers to get better and can do this job for us.'