Forthcoming Lists Discussion and Random Speculation Vol.3

[med]

I get the same sense, though looking more closely at just the new and upcoming releases, Kiss Me Deadly, Phantom Carriage, Four Feathers, Island of Lost Souls, and the Vigo set each have commentaries. I don't know, did more of them used to have one?

Maybe it's just a matter of Criterion's ramping up their release schedule but keeping the commentary tracks at about the same amount. I don't know. I rarely listen to commentaries all the way through, anyway, so I can’t say I care.

[zedz]

I get the same sense, though looking more closely at just the new and upcoming releases, Kiss Me Deadly, Phantom Carriage, Four Feathers, Island of Lost Souls, and the Vigo set each have commentaries. I don't know, did more of them used to have one?

Going back to 2008 (the first Blu year), I count 18 releases with commentaries (not including two 'selected-scene commentaries', which are basically not that much different from 'visual essays', and counting the release with two commentaries only once); as opposed to 12 this year.

I'm not too concerned about lost commentaries, but more worried about the seeming shift away from extensive extras on several recent releases. I think there have been more releases this year with what would once have been 'lower tier'-level extras than in a long, long time.

EDIT: Actually, it would be more than 18 commentaries in 2008. The reissue of High and Low, for instance, added a commentary.

[matrixschmatrix]

I'm not too concerned about lost commentaries, but more worried about the seeming shift away from extensive extras on several recent releases. I think there have been more releases this year with what would once have been 'lower tier'-level extras than in a long, long time.

Yeah, not counting totally barebones ones, Black Moon, Cul-de-Sac, Secret Sunshine, Kuroneko, Something Wild, and probably a fair number of others all seem as though they would have been lower tier from the paucity of extras on them. I guess it may just be that they've collapsed the old $30 and $40 price points.

At any rate, I really love commentaries, particularly scholarly ones- and Criterion was really consistent about avoiding shitty fluff ones, too. I hope we're not going to see them phased out at all.

[Tribe]

Had everyone not chased Peter Cowie away after his commentary on Diary of a Country Priest, maybe we'd have more commentaries these days.

[Doctor Sunshine]

I still get mad thinking about that simile.

I think the novelty of commentaries wore off for Criterion (for me too) but they've really stepped up their visual essays and video pieces. Those long, painful silences seem to be a thing of the past. To this day I have no idea how much of the Andrei Rublev commentary I heard and how much I skipped over trying to find the next bit.

[Roger Ryan]

I still get mad thinking about that simile.

I think the novelty of commentaries wore off for Criterion (for me too) but they've really stepped up their visual essays and video pieces. Those long, painful silences seem to be a thing of the past. To this day I have no idea how much of the Andrei Rublev commentary I heard and how much I skipped over trying to find the next bit.

To be fair, the ANDREI RUBLEV commentary itself has chapter headings, so you can just select those to hear everything (however, you do end up dropping in a few seconds after the commentary segment has begun and have to go back a bit to hear it all).

[aox]

I wish the bigger, more canonical films, had commentaries. Bicycle Thieves was a missed opportunity IMO.

[Scott Nye]

I think the novelty of commentaries wore off for Criterion (for me too) but they've really stepped up their visual essays and video pieces. Those long, painful silences seem to be a thing of the past. To this day I have no idea how much of the Andrei Rublev commentary I heard and how much I skipped over trying to find the next bit.

As much as I do love visual essays, there's nothing quite like a really great, thorough commentary track, when the scholar (and I do prefer scholarly tracks) has really done their homework and has plenty to say on the subject. I always point to the Gene Youngblood one on L'Avventura, but I also really loved Annette Insdorf on The Double Life of Veronique (who successfully toed the line between giving tons of insight and letting the film retain its mystery), Gary Giddins on Paths of Glory, Richard Pena on L'Eclisse...and on and on.

Then there's something like the full-on assault of commentaries on Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas, which are all sort of nuts but, given the film, pretty wonderful. Or the scientific commentary of Armageddon, which, aside from aiding me in a paper I wrote in college (those were the days...), is such a dumb idea that it turns around and becomes brilliant (due in no small part to the collective knowledge and good humor of the participants).

Both the tracks on The Third Man are sort of the perfect example of what a commentary does better than a visual essay - Dana Polan took a thesis and applied it all the way across the film, filling in the gaps with other thoughts and observations, while Steven Soderbergh and Tony Gilroy had a more relaxed conversation that stemmed from the film's production, style, structure, and themes.

Sure they're time-consuming, but as an avid listener of lengthy podcasts, I've become enamored by the rich pleasures of extended conversations. Visual essays might get the point across more succinctly, but great commentaries almost always yield something even the speaker didn't expect. Maybe they'll take a second to point out some tiny, cinephiliac moment and how those small bits increase the pleasure of the picture immensely (Bogdanovich's track on Warner's Bringing Up Baby is, unsurprisingly, chock full of these). I always love hearing people describe the moments that make them fall in love with a film that I also adore.

Anyway...I do so love commentaries, and to the people at Criterion, seeing one on a disc's special features does increase the likelihood that I'll buy it. For whatever that's worth.

[jouvet]

I agree that it's disappointing to see a certain decline in the number of commentary tracks being commissioned. I know someone who recorded one and understand how much time and research it requires -- Criterion staff like Kim Hendrickson are very much involved in advising as well as technical production -- but it seems like a lost opportunity to send out so many discs without that option.

I do also think that Criterion could do more to widen their net and invite more historians/scholars/experts to contribute. One of the best rationales for sticking with commentaries is that beginning film students, in my opinion, often turn to them far more readily than readings or harder-to-find research as they get to know more challenging films. Riche's work on RASHOMON, for example, can really open that film up to newcomers to Kurosawa. There's a whole community of film scholars out there who would love to be involved with Criterion productions, and who aren't expecting a large paycheck for so doing. Why not tap into that?

[Jun-Dai]

I always wished that they'd broaden their net of commentators to non-English speakers. I'm more than willing to read subtitles for commentary tracks, and I'd love to hear what Suzuki collaborators would have to say during one of his films, or what some Japanese scholars would say during an Ozu film (or for that matter, a non-Japanese film).

[colinr0380]

Absolutely. Plus manicsounds mentioned here that there were a lot more extras on the Korean disc of Secret Sunshine, including a commentary, which Criterion passed over for whatever reason. Perhaps Criterion, apart from in a few isolated incidences, shy away from subtitled commentary tracks, but that would seem to limit the horizons for contributors a lot.

And I totally agree with Scott Nye's comments on commentaries - they're different beasts from video essays, and perform separate functions (for example the visual essays on Criterion's Rules of the Game discs allow both for new voices on the film and for specific, brief sections of the film to be considered in greater detail than would be possible otherwise. A commentary considers the film from a much more wholistic perspective as well as placing it in wider contexts of the filmmaker's career, critical reception etc).

Sure a terrible (badly edited or recorded, or without much advance planning in evidence) commentary might be particularly painful to listen through but a great one can redefine our perspectives on a film entirely. For example a lot of my favourite commentaries are for films which I either have problems with or feel are flawed in some way (Major Dundee and The Osterman Weekend particularly come to mind), and having a kind of guide through the world of the film as it is unfolding helps me appreciate the aspects of a film that do work much more.

[matrixschmatrix]

I always wished that they'd broaden their net of commentators to non-English speakers. I'm more than willing to read subtitles for commentary tracks, and I'd love to hear what Suzuki collaborators would have to say during one of his films, or what some Japanese scholars would say during an Ozu film (or for that matter, a non-Japanese film).

Or they could do something they used to do, which is have the commentary translated and read by an actor- either way, I'd be happier with that than with nothing.

I agree with ColinR about the value of a commentary on a difficult or flawed film, too- the Stephen Prince commentary on Straw Dogs is so valuable that I've been resisting getting other editions of the movie, because I think I like the commentary more than I like the film itself. Certainly, I don't think I would have tried to watch that movie more than once (or, for that matter, have bought Prince's book) without it.

[Jarpie]

I think main reason why Criterion doesn't put commentaries on discs which would require subtitles is because they seem to try to get away with as few subtitles as possible. Watch any film which is mostly in some other langue, like french and has some scenes in english - Criterion doesn't subtitle the english lines, ever.

I've also asked them to subtitle the extras, but so far with no luck.

[med]

Why would they subtitle English dialogue when the great majority of people who buy their releases speak the language.

[cdnchris]

Well, it would be nice for when dialogue can be a little hard to hear because of accents for example. Watching Carlos there are some English lines I had trouble with and would have appreciated the subs. Also I'm sure the hard of hearing would like it.

[med]

I get that. In Merry Christmas Mr Lawrence, some of Ryuichi Sakamoto's English-language lines are difficult to understand thanks to his almost-impenetrable accent. But for the most part, like the few bits of English in The Warped Ones—which I watched last night—it's unnecessary.

[Anhedionisiac]

Well, I'm deaf. And believe me, there are few things in life that annoy me more than not being able to understand something because it's not subtitled. Even minor offenders like scenes in japanese films where they briefly start talking english, such as the ones med mentions.

[Gregory]

I think main reason why Criterion doesn't put commentaries on discs which would require subtitles is because they seem to try to get away with as few subtitles as possible...

I would speculate that the main reason is the expense of paying a translator to do an entire commentary track, most of which have a lot more to translate than your average film. These things don't come cheap, and even with a film that Criterion expects to sell well, they may not be able to budget all that additional expense for an extra feature. (They may also be aware that a lot of their customers who listen to the commentaries put them on while they're puttering around doing other things, not looking at the screen.)

[colinr0380]

I'm sure those years of DVD Beaver polls proudly proclaiming "I don't listen to commentary tracks!" did not help either.

While we are on the subject of audio features that seem to have fallen out of favour in recent years, what about isolated scores? I don't think one of those has been on a Criterion disc for a long time now. Is that because of a lack of interest amongst consumers; a lack of interest on the part of the disc producers; or maybe logistical problems in trying to licence such material, or finding an appropriate release to put a score onto?

[knives]

Well it can't be the last one since they didn't do isolated on Merry Christmas Mr. Lawrence, a soundtrack that is definitely more famous than the movie. That said extra films, interviews, and visual essays are typically all I watch now a days anyway extras wise.

[movielocke]

isolated scores have enormous licensing and residual issues that prevent them being a common extra.

[onedimension]

So 2011 started with Fuller reissues and ends with Suzuki reissues - what are the most wanted/needed blu upgrades and new transfers now?

Andrei Rublev, obviously- I'd add Col. Blimp, The Lady Eve, All That Heaven Allows, & Tokyo Story -

[knives]

Blimp is probably a good year or two away. I wouldn't expect it before Thanksgiving.

[Jarpie]

Why would they subtitle English dialogue when the great majority of people who buy their releases speak the language.

For hard of hearing viewers like Anhedionisiac, and even though I understand spoken english very well, it helps with accents and/or fast-paced dialogue when there are english subtitles.

[HistoryProf]

Blimp is probably a good year or two away. I wouldn't expect it before Thanksgiving.

why? I'd say Passion of Joan of Arc, Rififi, Picnic at Hanging Rock, The Night Porter, The River, Insomnia, Good Morning, Ali: Fear Eats the Soul, Devil and Daniel Webster, Mamma Roma, Elevator to the Gallows, Tunes of Glory, Ugetsu, Spirit of the Beehive, Ace in the Hole, Mishima: A Life in Four Chapters, Missing, and Virgin Spring. Oh, and the BRD Trilogy.

Given the example of the opening/closing duos though, I'd love to see them put out upgrades of these together: Oliver Twist/Great Expectations, Sirks, Lady Eve/Sullivan's Travels, Mon Oncle/Hulot, Last Wave w/ PaHR, the early Clairs, Ichikawas, and Thieves' Highway/Night and the City (or the closely numbered Beckers and Suzukis for that matter).

so that's all...hopefully they'll get right on those.