Hou Hsiao-hsien

[hearthesilence]

Flowers of Shanghai is screening tonight in a 35mm print at the Walter Reade Theater in Lincoln Center at 6pm. The DVD is out-of-print in the U.S., but even though it's easy to find, it's a pretty crappy transfer (just like most if not all DVD releases of this film).

[whaleallright]

Not to mention that of all films, this is probably the one you most want to see in 35mm. In particular, the blacks simply can't come through on standard definition video; in fact I doubt that even an immaculate HD transfer could capture the deep blacks and exquisitely subtle shading of this film.

The existing subtitles (on DVDs and theatrical prints) of this film are very poor, leaving too much incorrectly and incompletely translated. Some of the film's vaunted narrative obscurity is a matter of cultural references and contextual cues that would be picked up by a Chinese but not a Western audience.

On the darknet (that is, a particular torrent-site-which-will-remain-unnamed) there's been a project to combine the best available video transfers with new English subtitles (which in addition to translating dialogue provide what might best be called footnotes to some of the more culturally-specific references). It gives me hives when I think that no distributor (not even Criterion) would take this kind of trouble with a release. Any DVD release of City of Sadness, for example, ought to come with a variety of variety of material on Taiwanese history, the history of the Taiwan New Cinema, etc. Something like the web site set up by two scholars at the University of Michigan in the 1990s (which I can't find now!), which included a map of Taiwan detailing the different locations where the film's scenes took place, a family tree to help keep the characters' relationships clear (which apparently originated in the liner notes to a Japanese laserdisc edition), an analysis of Hou's visual style and a comparison with that of Ozu, an essay about the film's mixed reception in the Taiwan press in 1989, etc. But I simply can't imagine any company putting forth this level of effort. That's presuming the rights issues could even be sorted out.

It's a shame, because both Flowers of Shanghai and City of Sadness seem to me--and by no means only me--to be two of the most dauntingly ambitious and formally achieved films in the history of the cinema. And it seems like they are destined to remain unknown or underappreciated even by most cinephiles.

[FerdinandGriffon]

It's a shame, because both Flowers of Shanghai and City of Sadness seem to me--and by no means only me--to be two of the most dauntingly ambitious and formally achieved films in the history of the cinema. And it seems like they are destined to remain unknown or underappreciated even by most cinephiles.

I was there last night, seeing the film for the first time, and I agree completely.

[Calvin]

I thought that the HD restoration of Dust in the Wind would have provided the opportunity for Hou's work to get more exposure but, bafflingly, it appears that no distributor is interested in releasing it (or, indeed, the majority of his films)

[Perkins Cobb]

Saw the 35mm print of Flowers last night and was properly dazzled. It's the first time I've seen a film in the Walter Reade and been distracted by the green exit sign near the bottom of the screen -- that's how powerful those inky blacks to which Jonah refers were. I'm not often left thinking I need to see a film again, immediately, but that was the case here; I was so seduced by the style, Hou's long, langorous camera moves, the production design, and the mournful music, that I only semi- followed the intricate plot, which is conveyed mostly through dialogue and off-screen action. I suspect that if I spoke the language I'd have been much more drawn in by the stories than by the look of the film.

Are there multiple cuts of Flowers of Shanghai? The print shown last night was about 115 minutes, but the Variety review says 120 and various other websites (including, inaccurately, FSLC's program notes) claim 130. If there's another 15 minutes out there I'd love to see them.

[hearthesilence]

I don't think there are any multiple cuts, but I noticed the different running times too - I wouldn't make too much of it.

Couldn't leave work in time to see this, but apparently this was never actually distributed in the U.S. (Someone told me the first Hou film to get real distribution in the U.S. was probably Three Times, which was finished in 2005 or 2006, and even then, it was only on a few screens.) Such a shame, I remember when I first got into Hou while I was still living in Illinois around 2005 - I didn't know any film buffs who had seen his movies. I was startled when someone I knew finally brought him up - moreso because he loved movies, but rarely, rarely sees any foreign films, much less foreign language art films that never get recognized by the Academy. He was interested because he was Asian (parents were from Taiwan) and was simply curious about a Taiwanese film that was getting some good press from the Chicago Tribune.

Anyway, really wish I had caught this...hopefully someone will play it again soon, maybe even a retrospective.

[Perkins Cobb]

I don't think there are any multiple cuts, but I noticed the different running times too - I wouldn't make too much of it.

My instinct is the same ... in which case, this becomes a fascinating example of how totally impossible it is for the film (and cinephile) communities to get one seemingly simple fact right. I mean, I see this all the time with run times in program notes, especially for really obscure films, but Flowers of Shanghai is not that, and yet with a Google search you'll see a range of widely variant figures (113, 120, 125, 130) split pretty evenly among major sources. How exactly do these errors proliferate?

[whaleallright]

The Film Center in Chicago was a little ahead of the curve on Taiwanese New Cinema (as they were on Iranian and Hong Kong cinema), and brought in a few retrospectives, including a Hou Hsiao-Hsien one in (I think) 1999 or 2000 that I attended religiously. That was I think the midwest premiere of Flowers of Shanghai. I was able to see it subsequently in Boston.

I doubt a film that requires so much patience and careful attention will ever find a wide audience even by the standards of art cinema, but if the similarly challenging Gertrud and Ordet can make Sight & Sound's top 50 (as they did this year), I don't see why Flowers of Shanghai can't eventually. If people can see it, that is.

[The Fanciful Norwegian]

There are definitely at least two cuts of Flowers of Shanghai. The domestic version used a different, more chronological sequencing and could plausibly have had a different runtime as well. There's an old, non-English-subbed Taiwanese DVD of this edit, but I don't believe the recent box set edition (discussed on the previous page) used it; I'll have to check it when I get a chance.

[hearthesilence]

Whoah, no kidding? That sounds like an enormous difference. Is the domestic/Taiwanese cut the preferred version?

FWIW, I found a clip of what may be that communal bittorrent project jonah.77 mentioned. The subtitles definitely need work, but otherwise, the translation is better and more complete.

[Rupert Pupkin]

One Day is available on blu-ray on yesasia....
Is there a country where Millenium Mambo and/or Three Times have been released and/or announced on blu-ray ???? [-o<

[The Fanciful Norwegian]

I don't think there's a country where any Hou films have been announced on BD, bar the already-released Dust in the Wind. The CMPC has another Hou title in their library (The Time to Live and the Time to Die) that they could theoretically do in the future, but they haven't mentioned it. In fact the entire CMPC "Digitally Remastered" line seems to be dead, although they premiered a new restoration of In Our Time earlier this year.

Whoah, no kidding? That sounds like an enormous difference. Is the domestic/Taiwanese cut the preferred version?

FWIW, I found a clip of what may be that communal bittorrent project jonah.77 mentioned. The subtitles definitely need work, but otherwise, the translation is better and more complete.

Those are the exact same subtitles on the recent box set release. Opensubtitles also has an identical set of subtitles uploaded in 2004, so I seriously doubt they come from any communal translation project. There is a fan translation of this out there, though I don't think it's connected to whatever jonah.77 was talking about. I correspond with the translator on occasion, and he once mentioned that the subtitles for the drinking game have nothing to do with what they're actually saying, and even the Chinese subtitles were useless in that case. There were lots of problems like that, which was one reason it took him a couple of years to finish.

As for the two cuts, the box set DVD uses the familiar version (which I'll call the international cut). Since Sinomovie put that out themselves, I'll assume Hou is okay with it. I've never seen him address the issue anywhere.

[hearthesilence]

The editing of the subtitles seemed so slipshod and the "visual quality" so crisp compared to the PQ of the movie, I just figured they were homemade. (The drop shadow also looked unusual - I think this may be the first time I've ever seen drop shadow on subtitles, at least drop shadow that was this noticeable.) That's pretty horrible.

[hearthesilence]

FWIW, The National Film & Sound Archive, Australia is screening an imported 35mm print of The Flowers of Shanghai in two weeks on August 19th at 2 pm.

[whaleallright]

See it. See it!

[The Fanciful Norwegian]

Hou's long-long-long-long-in-the-works martial-arts film The Assassin had its opening ceremony yesterday, marking the official start of production. The catch is that they're only beginning the location-scouting phase and actual shooting begins next spring. Shu Qi, Chang Chen, Nikki Shie, and Chang Shao-huai were all there, along with Lee Ping-bin, naturally. Satoshi Tsumabuki -- who's been attached for ages and was even in some test footage shot in 2010 -- was conspicuously absent and Hou declined to say whether he's still in, so there's mass speculation that he's fallen victim to the Diaoyu/Senkaku nonsense. Hou raised the budget (about US$14 million) himself -- about half from Taiwan and half from China -- which is one reason it's taken so long. He also thinks that he and Wong Kar-wai are the only directors still making proper wuxia films and that 3D "doesn't make sense."

[Zot!]

He also thinks that he and Wong Kar-wai are the only directors still making proper wuxia films

Is this meant as a joke or something? I think I've seen most of his movies, but I don't remember any martial arts. At least WKW made Ashes of Time.

[Peacock]

The Grandmasters

[andyli]

He meant NOWADAYS only WKW and he are making proper wuxia films (referring two current production The Grandmasters and The Assassin). I think this is more of a jab at directors who used to make 'proper' wuxia films, such as Tsui Hark.

[Zot!]

gotcha, thanks, I was confused, as he hasn't even started filming, so it seemed a bit early to start lavishing praise on himself. I'm very much looking forward to both movies.

[zedz]

I've just noticed that this 10-DVD box set of films produced by Peggy Chiao includes (the first English subtitled release of?) HHH, Olivier Assayas' portrait of Hou Hsiao-hsien.

I'm probably not going to bite, given the price of the set, unless a lot of those other films are highly recommended.

In other Hou news, there's a BluRay out of Jia Zhangke's lovely I Wish I Knew, which includes an interview with Hou, and also one of 10+10, the portmanteau film to which Hou contributed his 5-minute La Belle Epoque.

[roujin]

Only heard of Beijing Bicycle and Blue Gate Crossing from that bunch, but heard positive things about them.

[gcgiles1dollarbin]

Fascinating look at Hou Hsiao-hsien and crew on the set of his next film, written by James Udden on David Bordwell's blog.

[shaky]

Production has once again stopped on Hou's new film

http://www.filmbiz.asia/news/hous-assas ... um=twitter" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[repeat]

And out of nowhere: it's a wrap!